winch

[package deal]

i am wanting to buy a winch for my h1. wanted to know if anyone has had anyexperience with this. i would like one that i can switch from front to back via a receiver hitch. where can i order one for the best price and what size do i need. thanks in advance for your help

[package deal]

i am wanting to buy a winch for my h1. wanted to know if anyone has had anyexperience with this. i would like one that i can switch from front to back via a receiver hitch. where can i order one for the best price and what size do i need. thanks in advance for your help

[ckhagman]

Check out http://www.bluehummer.com If he doesn't have it, he might be able to help you out anyway.

Also check out http://www.humvee.net/hid/acc/index.html at the bottom of the page it has some info which might help.

[Hummer Guy]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by package deal:
i am wanting to buy a winch for my h1. wanted to know if anyone has had anyexperience with this. i would like one that i can switch from front to back via a receiver hitch. where can i order one for the best price and what size do i need. thanks in advance for your help </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'd look at any WARN winch. How much do you think you'll be switching from front to back? Where I used to work we had an H2 that we had to take on and off if we wanted to use it. Do-able with one person, but easier with two. Plus, the connections tend to get muddied up when you switch back and forth. We had 4 H1s and all had front winches. I'd try just getting the factory-style-front winch, unless you really needed to switch it to the back.

[tower]

The general rule of thumb in off-roading is to employ a winch with capacity 1 1/2 to two times your vehicle weight. Despite needing to overcome friction in many situations, this capacity, along with a mechanical advantage which can be created using a snatchblock, should get you (or anyone else) out of trouble most of the time.

That being said, I have never seen a winch & cradle setup with a capacity over 9,000 lbs. Unless the winch was hydraulic, it would probably be prohibitively heavy. If memory serves, the H1 with gear weighs in at around 8,000 lbs, GVWR. So you would want a winch with at least a 12,000 lb. capacity. Such a cradle setup may exist somewhere, but I have never seen it.

[Beastmaster]

You can do a MileMarker E12000 with the winch mounting receiver plate.

I've been waiting for someone else to do it. Now someone has and wrote something on it.

http://www.rockcrawler.com/techreports/removable_winch/index.asp

[GeneseeMtn]

I just bought that same winch (MM E12,000) for My H1. Check http://www.angryiron.com, they had the best price.

[Hummer Guy]

I don't remember--who does AM General use for the H1 winch--Milemarker? or Warn...

[PARAGON]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Hummer Guy:
I don't remember--who does AM General use for the H1 winch--Milemarker? or Warn... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>One would think you should know that being a salesperson and especially with that monicker you gave yourself.

[Beastmaster]

Stock winch is the Warn 12000. It's claim to fame is that it degrades from the approach angle.

The winch works fine, however.

AMG will not warranty any parts that have a Hydraulic MileMarker attached. They have no issues with the E12000, as far as I have heard.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Hummer Guy:
I don't remember--who does AM General use for the H1 winch--Milemarker? or Warn... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

[GeneseeMtn]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Stock winch is the Warn 12000. It's claim to fame is that it degrades from the approach angle. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Steve - I even modified my MileMarker E12k fairlead from the factory configuration to have more approach angle. As is from the factory, it hangs down about 2" below the winch bumper.

[Hummer Guy]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Hummer Guy:
I don't remember--who does AM General use for the H1 winch--Milemarker? or Warn... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>One would think you should know that being a salesperson and especially with that monicker you gave yourself. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif I just couldn't remember since we used both brands at my last academy. We had to replace several remotes for our MM, and one had to be completely replaced. Unfortunately there isn't much winching done in the showroom -- but thanks for the brush-up...I'm sure there's lots of things I could learn from everybody here.

[Harley]

OK, I'll display my ignorance publicly with this question...

1. Which winch (for the H1) do you feel is the best "bang for the buck" so to speak.

2. Which set up will detract the least from the approach angle?

3. I don't get to wheel very often because I can't take too much time away from the business right now, (and for that matter, my winching experience was with an F250 pulling people out of ditches for spare change in high school in Oregon to and from skiing).

4. I've read back through all the threads here and on the "other" hummer website. I've pretty much decided I'd prefer to go w/ an electric rather than a hydraulic setup.

K

[Beastmaster]

Hehe...you've hit on one of the more debated questions out there.

Bang for the buck - Many people agree that the MileMarker E12000 winch gives one of the best bangs for the buck. It's 12000lb capacity and it's light weight makes it a very good choice.

Approach angle - There's two mounting methods that won't detract from the angle (much).

1) The stock MileMarker HMMWV/H1 mounting kit. This will keep nearly all of the approach angle.
2) Make a custom front bumper receiver mount. With front bumpers going for 50 bucks on EBay, you can make your own receiver mount for pretty cheap...far less than the stock Milemarker variant.

Now, I can say one thing about electric. You better have a really good method of disabling the solenoid box. There has been reports (in the general 4x4 world, Hummers included) of vandalism where someone freespools the winch line out, attaches it to something immovable, (rear bumper comes to mind), and shorts out the solenoid box. This then activates the winch, and then it literally crunches anything in the cable path.

Hence my logic of using a removeable carrier type of winch.

Hope this helps,
Steve

[Harley]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Hence my logic of using a removeable carrier type of winch. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You mean like "Package Deal" at the first of this string was asking?
Can a mount like you suggested to him not detract from approach angle?

Electric still seems like the best way, right?

I'm humbled here everytime I ask a question...

Thanks,
K

[Harley]

"Warning: To prevent serious injury: Do not use winches to move people:..." ---warning on the Mile Marker website...

...some one had to have gone there ....

K

[Beastmaster]

Well, that's the glory of running a removable winch. It won't detract from the approach angle when it's off.

Dave Breggin's got a design (that I'm getting ready to copy) of a receiver mounted winch. I've got a spare bumper all ready to weld and use as a test mule.

For a visual example:
http://www.humvee.net/hall/breg2.html

-Steve

[Harley]

So, did he weld a reciever onto the front of his truck to come out the middle hole?

K

[Beastmaster]

Sort of. There's a subframe behind it that helps reinforce and takes the majority of the load.

My project (once I find an appropriate Class III receiver to be the sacrificial lamb) will be similar.

Mine will be a bit different than Dave's, where I'll end up covering all 3 holes, and welding the receiver to the entire bumper, with mounting holes to the existing frame points, and gussets to help reinforce the bumper and the receiver.

-Steve

[Harley]

Let me know how it goes... I have a guy here in town that will do stuff like that... (I'm not smart enough, I start fires and **** when I start welding....)

K

[Beastmaster]

Well, it all depends on the thickness of the receiver that's going to be sacrificed.

If it's thicker than 3/8", I'm going to have to sub it out. Either way, it's a good start to have it ready to go.

Once that's done, I'll slowly acquire a winch mounting kit, then the winch itself.

[Harley]

Keep me posted!! Send photos, if possible!

K

[RonB]

the warn (stock) winch is very nice, however it adds several inches the the length of the truck and your front approach goes from near 70 deg to 47 (according to the manual). It's also expensive (but one can't really put a price on a quality item that will save our butts in a pickle).

I bought the E-12000. It's a much smaller winch so it tucks between the frame rails behind a cool front bumper mount MileMarker makes. It's also much lighter than the Warn. The E-12k with it's bumper mount weighs roughly 135 lbs (in contrast the Warn with it's mounting/hardware wieghs 162 lbs). The stock bumper/skidplate combo that is romoved is about 25 lbs, so with the MM you add about 110 lbs to the front of the truck (I use Amsteel synthetic and a smaller fairlead and knocked another 38 lbs off the front of the truck). I didn't want to change my front springs (or lose a limb if the cable snapped).

I had to grind down some brackets to make the winch fit, and the control box is a bit wanky (plus there's nowhere to put it). On the HML alot of guys put theirs on the battery hold down bracket, which is what I did. I temporarily put my control connector in the wheel well on the battery shield until I find a cool place to mount it in the truck and/or near the ctis pump.

Hope this helps and doesn't confuse you as much as I was re-reading my post. If no one has pictures of this I could snap a few, but there's really nothing special about my set-up -- I just followed what others had done.

Ron B

[Harley]

Thanks, Ron, I'd be most indebted w/ photos...

K

[RonB]

here are some snap shots:
the MM control box mounted to the battery hold down bracket. I moved the winch control connector from the box to the right hand side of the slash shield. It's not the best place, but good for a few months until I figure out a better place. Someone on the HML put theirs in the glove box...interesting!

RB

[RonB]

the front. I think the smaller fairlead is much cleaner looking and a must for synthetic rope. Shawn at Angry Iron sells Amsteel in a cool green color now. Mine is blue, the green you see is a 10ft. abrasion protection sleve. I couldn't re-use my hook from the old cable because it would not fit on the end of the amsteel rope -- I just use a D-shackle. I got 100' of 3/8 amsteel rope and the fairlead from Willysoffroad for about $230.

[RonB]

here's kind of a side view. Notice there is little to no loss of approach angle. The Warn sticks out about 3 inches beyond the brushguard mounting brackets. You can see the winch tucked between the frame rails, it's a tight fit! Thats why the control box is on the battery hold-down bracket -- no room on the winch, and putting in front on the bumper is asking for trouble.

[Harley]

how much winching have you done with that cable? I know you like it or you wouldn't still have it. Are you satisfied with it vs. steel?

K

[RonB]

here's one more from the top. You'll notice a large guage blue wire -- the supplied cable seemed a bit on the flimsy side so I got the beefiest stuff I could from a local sterio install place. I also had to shorten that radiator hos on the top -- it was rubbing on the top of the wires.

Again, I am not saying one winch is better than the other (the Warn seems beefier, and it's cost reflects this) I just didn't want to sacrafice approach angle or break my piggy bank. Good luck!

Ron B

[RonB]

sorry about my spelling!

[Harley]

that's exactly where I'm coming from...

K

[RonB]

To be honest, I haven't used it yet. For me, it is better for four reasons (these reasons can be applied to most all synthetic rope, not just amsteel):
1 - it's 25 lbs lighter (100' amsteel is 4 lbs, 100' cable is 29 lbs).
2 - it's rated at a higher capacity, 20,400 lbs versus 14,400 lbs (please correct me if I'm wrong here -- going by my failing memory).
3 - it's safer -- it won't recoil if it breaks
4 - it's easier to handle -- it won't shred your hand with birrs or freeze in them in winter. It won't kink, or rust. It floats. It's easy to re-spool.

The rope is obviously more prone to rock abrasion, and you have to keep it clean -- but you should really be careful with cable too. The aluminum fairlead is also lower profile and 9 lbs lighter than the supplied MM roller fairlead.

When I had my H2, I had X-Line on the winch. It is similar to Amsteel but has a few other advantages such as handling high heat (it is more expensive, as is the master pull line). There's some pretty cool stuff available out there.

On a side note, MileMarker told me that they have not fully tested synthetic rope on their winches. Rope flattens out when there is weight on it and puts more pressure on the sides of the drum (more friction + more heat). I guess the Warn would be the same?

Ron B

[Beastmaster]

Many people have run synthetic on their MileMarkers with no issues at all.

-Steve

[RonB]

that's what I told the folks at MileMarker -- I was just trying to give the info I heard.

RB

[DRTYFN]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Beastmaster:
You can do a MileMarker E12000 with the winch mounting receiver plate.

I've been waiting for someone else to do it. Now someone has and wrote something on it.

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

After much testing with the MileMarker 12K winches I think I'm qualified to say BUY A WARN!!! I had problems with the clutch handles not releasing or engaging properly more than a few times.

Warn has a new line of winches called TABOR (http://www.warn.com/truck/winches/src/tabor_12k.shtml). Don't let the Value Series part fool you. They're a really solid performing winch. I'm using them in our winch bumpers.

[DRTYFN]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by RonB:
On a side note, MileMarker told me that they have not fully tested synthetic rope on their winches. Rope flattens out when there is weight on it and puts more pressure on the sides of the drum (more friction + more heat). I guess the Warn would be the same?

Ron B </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Warn used to say the same crap. Now they sell synthetic line. Pretty funny, since I knew they were looking into selling it when they told me that.

[Harley]

DRTY, is there a mounting kit for the "Tabor" (like the hidden one) for the H1? How will it affect angle of approach?

I drug the sh*t out of both front and back bumpers a couple of times today and it was on "Oklahoma Bumps"... nothing extreme...

K

[RonB]

I wonder if this new winch would fit in the Mile-Marker bumper? It looks just like the E-12k. I like the quality of Warn products.

RB

[DRTYFN]

It has the same foot print as the MM12K, but is slightly smaller(length-wise by about 2 inches).
I'm really pleased with the Warn Tabor winch.

Harley, do you have a stock H1 winch bumper? Any pictures? We haven't even thought of making a bumper(yet) for the H1.

[Harley]

I have the stock bumper / brush guard. (I started to make a comment about 'wenches' on my bumper... but.. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif )

I'll send some pics tonight when I get home!

K