WARNING ON RACNHO LIFT [Archive] - Hummer Forums by Elcova

View Full Version : WARNING ON RACNHO LIFT

timgco

12-18-2005, 03:26 PM

Many of you have been following my post on the Rancho 4" lift. I thouhgt I'd share why the lift is coming back off of my truck.

#1 reason; 16", 17", 18" tires will fit with the proper offset, however, the steering knuckle is less than 1/4" from touching the tire. So if you ever plan on off roading and airing down, the sidewall of your tire will touch and get trashed with their "required" 4.5" offest. I had to use a 1'4" wheel spacer so it would not touch the tire at the required aired up ammount.

when I called Rancho about this, they said the kit was desigend for a 20" rim with 5" of offset. using a smaller diameter rim will not allow for airing down. WTF is is good for than?

#2 reason: Your tires will stick out 3" to 4" at the top of the fenders. They stick out much more towards the bottoms of your flares. FOr those of you with the stock 33" tires and have driven through snow/ mud have seen what happens to your door/ door handles, and fender flares. Now take that X 10 and you can imagine what that looks like. This means the sides of your truck will be trashed in no time. After only 300 miles or so, the truck is already getting rock chips though the paint and the rear fender flares will look like swiss cheese in a couple thousand miles.

#3 Reason: When you get at highway speeds, the truck does not feel very stable at all. If you drive 75mph or higher on a daily basis, I would not get this lift.

On a positive note, this lift gives the truck a very aggresive stance and handles OK at 55mph or under. You will feel the tires grab your steering wheel on grooved surfaces or at places the road has those "trenches" in the blacktop from heavy trucks. But it's not too bad. You will get a ton of improved ground clearance, ap angle, and dp angle. You will also get somew vibration in the steering wheel and floor boards.

So, there's my 2 cents on this lift.

timgco

12-18-2005, 03:26 PM

bjklein21

12-18-2005, 03:43 PM

Maybe you should look into the rough country 5 inch lift. Its totally bolt on and looks great. I beleive the tires do not stick out the same as they do with the rancho kit plus you can use the factory wheels.

NEOCON1

12-18-2005, 04:57 PM

have also heard of inside tire damage from another when aired down , was at conejo offroad " local shop " the other day they didant have much nice to say about rancho http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif and no info on the 5in yet .

hmrlvr

12-18-2005, 05:17 PM

Well Timco tried the Rancho and we all learned. Who will be the 1st to try the Rough Country. Thanks for all the good info and follow up's Timco I'm sure you saved alot of people some time and trouble.

timgco

12-18-2005, 05:19 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by hmrlvr:
Well Timco tried the Rancho and we all learned. Who will be the 1st to try the Rough Country. Thanks for all the good info and follow up's Timco I'm sure you saved alot of people some time and trouble. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Glad I could help. Donations can be sent through paypal. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

MyxH3

12-18-2005, 05:38 PM

LOL so are you selling it then? http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

timgco

12-18-2005, 06:33 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MyxH3:
LOL so are you selling it then? http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No, It's going back to Rancho!

Ipedog

12-18-2005, 06:45 PM

Bummer that it didn't work out Tim. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif I would definitely send it back to Rancho, AND try to get them to cover installation/removal costs. What a PITA. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Maybe the Rough Country lift is a better way to go. Good Luck!

ETD

12-18-2005, 10:09 PM

Yes, thanks for the heads-up. As I had said, was gonna get one. Sorry it didn't work out http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

TA8088

12-18-2005, 11:05 PM

That sucks. Keep us posted on how Rancho responds.

crop000s

12-19-2005, 05:48 PM

Thanks for letting us know. I hate that it didn't work out like it should have. Seems like they rushed through the R&D to get it ready to market.

Sewie

12-19-2005, 10:56 PM

Thanks for all the info Tim. Will be interesting to hear how Rancho responds to this. Be sure to keep us updated.

BTW, the truck <STRIKE>looks</STRIKE> looked great. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif Hope you figure out a fix.

KenP

12-20-2005, 03:52 PM

Tim, sorry I missed this. That sucks.

You need to keep us informed on how Rancho handles this.

Maybe Rancho needs to designate their lifts as not good for wheeling because of the rim requirements. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

4churchill

12-20-2005, 04:38 PM

I drove the SEMA H3 that rancho did, last week, and I had the same feelings. Also the brakes were not up to the task.

Well off to plan B Tim

VTSTOMPER

12-27-2005, 01:43 AM

sorry to hear, er, read the news! http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Talljeeper

12-27-2005, 02:05 AM

You obviously chose the wrong wheel design...did you do a trial fit, or did you choose, "Thats looks cool"....seems to me if you had performed a trial fit you would have noted what offest was required. There also the issue of backspace which you never noted as well.

Ranchos H3 system is a very well designed, quality suspension system.

What you describe as far as ill handling can easily be attributed to tire tread design, improper inflation, poor alignment.....on and on.... http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Having had multiple Rancho systems over the years, I have yet to see a poor design from them, including the H3.

The H3 suspension is not a rocket science setup....

Also the comment on brakes.....anytime you add rotational mass at the axle brake performance degrades..... http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

While the RC setup looks pretty nice, the Rancho won't void the drivetrain warranty like the RC probably will.

You guys need to recognize the difference between these two mfg's..

Rancho bar none produces some of the finest off-road suspension systems manufactured...H3 included.

There is a reason the RC isn't being mass produced an that is to address bump steer issues...I am sure thay will reach a compromise on the design.

Humm3r

12-27-2005, 03:04 AM

Who are you....the spokesperson for Rancho?

Operator24

12-27-2005, 03:59 AM

IMHO Rancho is a decent and quick lift for most 4x4s out there. But there is alway other options. In the jeep world where I come from, rancho is not on the top of list for the serious wheeler. TeraFlex, Rubicon Express, Nth Degree, maybe full traction all come to mind. If any one of those companies made a lift for the H3, I'd buy it without hesitation. Truck companies I'd trust...well, one anyway is CST (california super trucks). They (CST) make durable well thought out truck kits. They're probably already working on kit for the H3, they're pretty quick with R&D. I know one of their former designers... he was crazy with his fabrication skills. Most of their staff is.

Operator24

12-27-2005, 04:21 AM

4churchill

12-27-2005, 04:33 AM

I'm pretty sure Tall Jeeper is ghey http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Talljeeper

12-27-2005, 04:44 AM

Nah, I dont work for Rancho.....in fact coming from a competitive racing fourwheelin' world Rancho is so so due to their conservative approach to suspension lifts.

To make a blanket statement that they suck based upon one individuals experience is ludicrous.

I ran down to 10# last weekend over some of the best trails Washington state has to offer and this was all day! Nary a rub....I am also running 35" rubber on 17" Moto's

The knuckle BOLT not the knuckle clears by over half an inch! If a guy was really tripped out over that clearance on the bolt (more than adequate by the way) you could easily replace it with a low profile quality high grade fastener...no biggy

With regards to the "knuckle" there is almost an inch clearance without the bolt....

If you notice the RC pics the tires extend past the fenders even with stock rims.....ok so....does that mean their setup sucks...hardly. Its a flippin wheel configuration.

Reason 3...truck doesn't "feel" stable....sounds like a personal subjective opinion to me....not a design flaw ( I guess if your cruisin north 25 out of Denver at 75-80 I could see why due to the construction, heII nothing would seem stable)

I could give a s*it less what people choose to buy for their rigs, but posting BS, is just that.

It is obvious that many posters don't have a lot of knowledge when comes to fourwheelers, fourwheelin, or moddin trucks. Hopefully those that do will respond with accurate experienced based feedback.

Operator24

12-27-2005, 04:47 AM

timgco

12-27-2005, 03:17 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Talljeeper:
You obviously chose the wrong wheel design...did you do a trial fit, or did you choose, "Thats looks cool"....seems to me if you had performed a trial fit you would have noted what offest was required. There also the issue of backspace which you never noted as well. <span class="ev_code_RED">4 WHeel Parts checked with Rancho and that backspace/ offset is what was required. 15, 16, and 17" all got the same. 18 and 20" was 5" of backspace. It wasn't enough and required wheel spacers ro it wouldn't touch the nuckle. Rancho's resonse to my questions/ issue was "the wheels should be 20" because that's what the kit was designed with and the kit was not designed to air down your tires." That quote is straight from their tech./ install dept. I'm sure since you drive a mighty Jeep off road, you know how great a 20" rim will do offroad and aired down.</span>

Ranchos H3 system is a very well designed, quality suspension system.<span class="ev_code_RED">It is well built, but the design of where that front nuckle ends up, is total BS... unless your cool with 20" rims or the entire tread sticking out of your fenders.I know you Jeepssters like that look. The problem with that is that some of the states that I go to, will pull you over in two seconds for that.</span>

What you describe as far as ill handling can easily be attributed to tire tread design, improper inflation, poor alignment.....on and on.... http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif <span class="ev_code_RED">Nope, I was assured everythign was aligned and balanced and inflated properly. And it was. The tires are not very aggressive, so I cannot see that being an issue at just higher speeds.</span>
Having had multiple Rancho systems over the years, I have yet to see a poor design from them, including the H3.<span class="ev_code_RED">Good for you.</span>

The H3 suspension is not a rocket science setup....

Also the comment on brakes.....anytime you add rotational mass at the axle brake performance degrades..... http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif<span class="ev_code_RED">Yep, that was his point! Having to use a 20" rim or larger is a bad design.</span>

While the RC setup looks pretty nice, the Rancho won't void the drivetrain warranty like the RC probably will.

You guys need to recognize the difference between these two mfg's..

Rancho bar none produces some of the finest off-road suspension systems manufactured...H3 included.

There is a reason the RC isn't being mass produced an that is to address bump steer issues...I am sure thay will reach a compromise on the design. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

timgco

12-27-2005, 03:28 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Talljeeper:
Nah, I dont work for Rancho.....in fact coming from a competitive racing fourwheelin' world Rancho is so so due to their conservative approach to suspension lifts.

To make a blanket statement that they suck based upon one individuals experience is ludicrous.<span class="ev_code_RED">that was my opinion on this lift! I don't see where anyone else even said that</span>

I ran down to 10# last weekend over some of the best trails Washington state has to offer and this was all day! Nary a rub....I am also running 35" rubber on 17" Moto's<span class="ev_code_RED">good for you and Jeep.</span>

The knuckle BOLT not the knuckle clears by over half an inch! If a guy was really tripped out over that clearance on the bolt (more than adequate by the way) you could easily replace it with a low profile quality high grade fastener...no biggy<span class="ev_code_RED">The nuckle was more the issue than the bolt was. When you air down to 18 (not that low of a preassure either) You can get the knuckle to stuff into the sidewall at certain angles. I didn't spend 5K on a lift/ rims, and tires so I can drive ti on the street,</span>

With regards to the "knuckle" there is almost an inch clearance without the bolt.... <span class="ev_code_RED">not true ont he setup I had.</span>

If you notice the RC pics the tires extend past the fenders even with stock rims.....ok so....does that mean their setup sucks...hardly. Its a flippin wheel configuration.<span class="ev_code_RED">And that's fine. Nothing some custom flares for $1000 couldn't fix. I think that would lokk like sh1t too!</span>

Reason 3...truck doesn't "feel" stable....sounds like a personal subjective opinion to me....not a design flaw ( I guess if your cruisin north 25 out of Denver at 75-80 I could see why due to the construction, heII nothing would seem stable)<span class="ev_code_RED">You are correct about the I25 North comment, but it was on 470, 25 South, I70 and didn't matter the road surface. But you are correct none the less. I 25 construction sucks in everything.</span>

I could give a s*it less what people choose to buy for their rigs, but posting BS, is just that.<span class="ev_code_RED">Yep, Rancho should advertise that a20' rim is needed. I agree with you.</span>

It is obvious that many posters don't have a lot of knowledge when comes to fourwheelers, fourwheelin, or moddin trucks. Hopefully those that do will respond with accurate experienced based feedback. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><span class="ev_code_RED">I'm sure that statement won't raise any hell! Well, Mr Pro Jeeper, I have responded to every one of your dumbass comments excpet for tha last one about the "posters" not knowing anything about fourwheelersm four wheelin, or modded trucks. that's just a troll statement. You should go back to your pro racing world of Jeeps. LMAO!</span>

Humm3r

12-27-2005, 06:47 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">quote:
Originally posted by Operator24:

quote:
Originally posted by Alec W:

quote:
Originally posted by Operator24:

quote:
Originally posted by Alec W:
Whatdiddickforbrainssay?

Well that was constructive.

Thx

I took the liberty of nominating you here because of you're outstanding display earlier...

http://www.thestupidawards.com/

I bet you win the '06 award hands down. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You're the winner of the "Too much time on my hands Award"

Operator24

12-27-2005, 10:43 PM

Do you really think I nominated him son?

Please tell me you're not that gullable. Kids these days...

I bet you think the rancho kit is best thing since sliced bread because the guy at 4 wheel parts says it is! http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Anonymous

12-27-2005, 10:57 PM

How many "competetive racing Jeeps" have you seen lately? While I'll admit they are excellent four wheelers and can be built into awesome rock crawlers, nonecould be considered "racing" vehicles. Case in point, of the 359 entries in this years Baja 1000, there were only 3 Jeep entries and none of them finished the race (there was even a Camaro that entered and finished). All of Team Hummer finished and won their classes.

NEOCON1

12-27-2005, 11:10 PM

yea lets hear it for the camaro http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

FormerJeeper

12-27-2005, 11:34 PM

Didn't I warn you all back in the beginning that Rancho made nothing but crap?

Maybe you'll believe me now http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

-C

timgco

12-27-2005, 11:39 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by FormerJeeper:
Didn't I warn you all back in the beginning that Rancho made nothing but crap?

Maybe you'll believe me now http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

-C </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hey, talljeeper thinks they're the best! http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I like their shocks still. I have had good luck with those, but after this, i'm done with their lifts.

Operator24

12-27-2005, 11:40 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Anonymous:
How many "competetive racing Jeeps" have you seen lately? While I'll admit they are excellent four wheelers and can be built into awesome rock crawlers, nonecould be considered "racing" vehicles. ... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ever heard of Jeepspeed? Its an entire class of cherokees that race all over the country.

Ever heard of UROC? ARCA? Jeeps and tube buggies all competing in rockcrawling events...and it is a race. You're timed. Therefore those are race trucks.

EDITED: (I think I missunderstood you originally Anonymous, sorry) I don't know what you mean by "race" vehicles but you're not comparing apples to apples here. Jeeps and baja trucks were designed to do two different things. Neither can do the other well. I don't see many baja trucks crawling in Lucern and yea, you don't see jeeps wining the baja 1000.

But this topic is less about jeeps vs. hummers than it is about rancho sucking ass at anything more than street wheeling. Lets focus here people.

Operator24

12-27-2005, 11:57 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Alec W:

Whatdiddumbf.ucksaynow?

Who gives a flying f.uck about your "coverage" for the largest off road publication in the world when all you did was suck a lot of dick.

Are you going to report me to some unheard of website for stupid people again http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

LMAO. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Its pretty easy to talk a lot of crap on the web... but to torque me, its going to take a lot more than anything you can come up with sport.

You can stop trying to act cool in front of your friends now.

Operator24

12-28-2005, 12:11 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Alec W:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Operator24:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Alec W:

Whatdiddumbf.ucksaynow?

Who gives a flying f.uck about your "coverage" for the largest off road publication in the world when all you did was suck a lot of dick.

Are you going to report me to some unheard of website for stupid people again http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

LMAO. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Its pretty easy to talk a lot of crap on the web... but to torque me, its going to take a lot more than anything you can come up with sport.

You can stop trying to act cool in front of your friends now. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
You’re already admitting e-enragement just by posting back, if you didn’t care you wouldn’t respond kiddo.

The ownage was easy with you http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You've posted many times on this topic but you've yet to say a single thing concerning the rancho lift (aka the topic at hand). I think you come on here because you can't get laid or someone didn't hug you enough as a child. Maybe mommy denied you the tit when you were 2 months old? Maybe you recently found out you were an accident child? We can rename your birthday "The Big Oooops" if we must. But it doesn't change the fact that you still haven't contributed to a single thing on this topic.

What does that tell you?

Go a head, say it... everyone else already knows, just blurt it out when you figure it out.

Operator24

12-28-2005, 12:18 AM

If thats how you want to "tuck the tail and run" then so be it. I was just getting warmed up.

EDIT: I think TIM's truck is cool. Seems like a nice guy, trying all these kits for us! http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

Operator24

12-28-2005, 12:27 AM

Well if thats all ya got I guess I'll let you keep your dignity, whats left of it anyway.

Operator24

12-28-2005, 12:30 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Alec W:
Raaaarrrrh!!!1 http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You got me there... .. . ? Good one. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Operator24

12-28-2005, 12:41 AM

Son? From the pic I see of you on your bike on another thread, you are old enough to be my father. I can't fix that for you and for that I'm sorry.

http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Operator24

12-28-2005, 12:56 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Alec W:
Did I ask that you fix that?

Teh enragement is strong, you can’t stop posting back http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

LMFAO http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Uh oh. You're still here and posting too...

I wonder what that means?

I think it means you've fallen and you can't get up... did you bust your hip?

Operator24

12-28-2005, 12:59 AM

I'm having a blast here.

Its not often someone will let you ride them this hard for free.

I feel like I should leave money on the night stand or something! http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

4churchill

12-28-2005, 06:24 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Operator24:
Do you really think I nominated him son?
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Operator24:
Here, I'm operator24. 24 is for the age. I'm currently 23 but that will change in early january so I'm just being efficient http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif, </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif How can a 23 year old have a son old enough to own a HUMMER?

Talljeeper

12-28-2005, 02:19 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by timgco:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Talljeeper:
You obviously chose the wrong wheel design...did you do a trial fit, or did you choose, "Thats looks cool"....seems to me if you had performed a trial fit you would have noted what offest was required. There also the issue of backspace which you never noted as well. <span class="ev_code_RED">4 WHeel Parts checked with Rancho and that backspace/ offset is what was required. 15, 16, and 17" all got the same. 18 and 20" was 5" of backspace. It wasn't enough and required wheel spacers ro it wouldn't touch the nuckle. Rancho's resonse to my questions/ issue was "the wheels should be 20" because that's what the kit was designed with and the kit was not designed to air down your tires." That quote is straight from their tech./ install dept. I'm sure since you drive a mighty Jeep off road, you know how great a 20" rim will do offroad and aired down.</span>
<span class="ev_code_BLUE">Installation of this system does not allow for re-use of OEM (factory) wheels.</span>
<span class="ev_code_BLUE">* This kit was developed using a 325/60/R20 on 20x9" wheel with 5.0" of back-spacing. Use of the maximum tire size 37 x 12.50 will require some trimming of the front air dam/fascia & inner fender well for clearance. Rancho recommends using 4.5" of backspacing on 16", 17", and 18" wheels, 20" and above we recommend using 5.0" backspacing. Before installing any other wheel/tire combinations, consult your local tire & wheel specialist.</span>
Ranchos H3 system is a very well designed, quality suspension system.<span class="ev_code_RED">It is well built, but the design of where that front nuckle ends up, is total BS... unless your cool with 20" rims or the entire tread sticking out of your fenders.I know you Jeepssters like that look. The problem with that is that some of the states that I go to, will pull you over in two seconds for that.</span>

What you describe as far as ill handling can easily be attributed to tire tread design, improper inflation, poor alignment.....on and on.... http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif <span class="ev_code_RED">Nope, I was assured everythign was aligned and balanced and inflated properly. And it was. The tires are not very aggressive, so I cannot see that being an issue at just higher speeds.</span>
Having had multiple Rancho systems over the years, I have yet to see a poor design from them, including the H3.<span class="ev_code_RED">Good for you.</span>

The H3 suspension is not a rocket science setup....

Also the comment on brakes.....anytime you add rotational mass at the axle brake performance degrades..... http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif<span class="ev_code_RED">Yep, that was his point! Having to use a 20" rim or larger is a bad design.</span>
<span class="ev_code_BLUE">ITS NOT THE RIM SIZE THAT CAUSES THE DEGRADATION ITS THE MASS>>>I.E. WEIGHT. Even if the combo was a 37" X 17" combo its the weight</span>
While the RC setup looks pretty nice, the Rancho won't void the drivetrain warranty like the RC probably will.

You guys need to recognize the difference between these two mfg's..

Rancho bar none produces some of the finest off-road suspension systems manufactured...H3 included.

There is a reason the RC isn't being mass produced an that is to address bump steer issues...I am sure thay will reach a compromise on the design. </div></BLOCKQUOTE> </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

MyxH3

12-28-2005, 03:11 PM

I agree Rancho makes good shocks... Well actually Monroe makes them, Rancho just puts their name on them. As far as the Quality of the Rancho system, it looks to be built nicely, good welds, nice paint ect.but theres alot more to the design than just looks. From the two kits that I have seen installed (not including tims, which I didnt see)The same problems have arisen for these owners as well, complaints of poor braking, bad handling as well as the compatable use of the stock tires/wheels. One of the people I know has already has had the kit taken off and returned it. The other is planning on haiving it taken off. The dealer oem Warranty is completed voided by using this kit reguardless of what TallJeep says. Maybe not from all dealers in the world but out here in Arizona is sure is. I have put over 700 miles of offroad use on my H3 and believe that one of the only issues with the H3 is clearance. I look forward to lifting mine like many others do and just want to have the right combination of height and handling without having to spend alot of wasted money just because it is a H3 and not a Chevy Colorado/Canyon (compare Lift Kit prices). I also have a Jeep with a RC 6" lift and it performs great with zero bumpsteer, articulates great, has plenty of clearance and allows me to use 33" tires without rubbing without any funky backspacing problems. It was affordable and EZ to install and the vehicle aligned with no problems at all. If Rough Country is going to offer the same product for the H3, well Thats awesome.I know I wont be putting on a Rancho kit, Thats for sure. I know hundreds of Jeep owners but not one of them actually owns a rancho lift although a great deal of them have the Monroe (Rancho) Shocks including me. I would really love to see other companies such as Rubicon Express, Rock Krawler as well as any other manufacture offer a lift for the H3. It would be great to more options and competition to bring the prices down to realitiy. I love the performance of my H3 and its offroad capabilities are great for being a stock vehicle with a Locker. I too look forward to having it for years and using it for what it was designed for. "Offroading". I just hate hearing people that Dont own an H3, tell people that do own one what the problem is and why. Course that is just my opinion,I could be wrong.

Operator24

12-28-2005, 04:03 PM

I plowed through 2 sets of rancho rs9000s on a Jeep TJ a few years ago. They lasted about a year each and then clearly lost their charge and drove like hell. They were a nice shock when I bought them though... just didn't last long. Seems to be the rancho motto: Great out of the box, not a friend of durability. I was a weekend wheeler though, that jeep saw heavy use every 6 days. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Bilstien makes a top notch shock. Fox makes a nice one too. Both of those will last. Fox stuff can all be rebuilt and recharged too.

Operator24

12-28-2005, 04:52 PM

timgco

12-28-2005, 05:02 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Operator24:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Alec W:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Operator24:
I own a Heep and know nothing about Hummers but I’ll be happy to make stuff up.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Fixed </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

FIXED AGAIN http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
I'm going now and go help a buddy of mine stroke off. Then were going to go wheelin. Have a great day. </div></BLOCKQUOTE> http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Operator24

12-28-2005, 08:09 PM

http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Yea yea. Whatever.

MyxH3

12-29-2005, 05:10 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Bilstien makes a top notch shock. Fox makes a nice one too. Both of those will last. Fox stuff can all be rebuilt and recharged too. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
agreed...
nice stuff for sure.

cherokeekid

12-29-2005, 04:15 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MyxH3:
The dealer oem Warranty is completed voided by using this kit reguardless of what TallJeep says.

I would really love to see other companies such as Rubicon Express, <span class="ev_code_RED">Rock Krawler </span> as well as any other manufacture offer a lift for the H3. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Having a RK kit is the last thing anyone needs! http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I worked in service for 6 years and typically the only "void" is on or related to the aftermarket component, its just a matter of finding a real service advisor (a good number are complete idiots)

H3 Guy

12-30-2005, 02:53 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MyxH3:
I also have a Jeep with a RC 6" lift and it performs great with zero bumpsteer, articulates great, has plenty of clearance and allows me to use 33" tires without rubbing without any funky backspacing problems. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

How do you get bumpsteer with a straight axle?

H3 Guy

12-30-2005, 02:56 PM

Regardless which kit you go with, the tires are going to sit outside of the fender at the same location. Rancho does it by using new wheels and Rough Country does it on the design of the knuckle. IMO a knuckle is not meant to have the higher moments and forces this way.

NoMoGMPG

12-30-2005, 03:56 PM

Rancho used to make good offroad gear. Now it is just mostly rebadged products or lift/suspension kits suitable for faux-wheeling at the mall parking lot or tractor pulls.

A supposed offroad enhancement like a lift kit that doesn't allow for the industry standard of 15/16/17" wheels to be aired down? BS.

Can you say "Poseur"? Sure you can...Rancho.

I'll be looking to Teraflex for "well thought out" suspension packages. Rancho is relegated to the J.C. Whitney group of suppliers.

PARAGON

12-30-2005, 04:02 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by H3 Guy:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MyxH3:
I also have a Jeep with a RC 6" lift and it performs great with zero bumpsteer, articulates great, has plenty of clearance and allows me to use 33" tires without rubbing without any funky backspacing problems. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

How do you get bumpsteer with a straight axle? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>You can the same way you get it with IFS. All bump steer is, is a very temporary toe misalignment.

H3 Guy

12-30-2005, 05:21 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by H3 Guy:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MyxH3:
I also have a Jeep with a RC 6" lift and it performs great with zero bumpsteer, articulates great, has plenty of clearance and allows me to use 33" tires without rubbing without any funky backspacing problems. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

How do you get bumpsteer with a straight axle? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>You can the same way you get it with IFS. All bump steer is, is a very temporary toe misalignment. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

But bumpsteer is the differential of toe angle vs the opposite side. On a jeep the are connected. Unless your refering to the flex of the steering linkage. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif I would really like to see a straight axle with bumpsteer changing from putting a kit on.

MyxH3

12-31-2005, 02:17 PM

.<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">But bumpsteer is the differential of toe angle vs the opposite side. On a jeep the are connected. Unless your refering to the flex of the steering linkage. I would really like to see a straight axle with bumpsteer changing from putting a kit on. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Bumpsteer is usually created by alignment issues, track bar and steering system angles/flex, loose parts. Very common on a lifted Heaps due to the steering angles and the flex of the steering

H3 Guy

12-31-2005, 03:17 PM

myxH3 agreed, although trackbar plays little if any role. My point was that bumpsteer is not the same as an IFS as stated by someone else. With a rack and pin setup, the placement of the rack in reference to the tie rod end location ( along with A arm length) is what gives you bumpsteer.

PARAGON

12-31-2005, 03:27 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by H3 Guy:
myxH3 agreed, although trackbar plays little if any role. My point was that bumpsteer is not the same as an IFS as stated by someone else. With a rack and pin setup, the placement of the rack in reference to the tie rod end location ( along with A arm length) is what gives you bumpsteer. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>You are trying to pigeon hole it for the sake of some argument. Bump steer is simply the toe being out temporarily for what-ever reason. Whether it be due to droop of IFS or flex in the linkage on a SFA, bump steer is bump steer.

The Dent God

01-08-2006, 11:41 PM

As I am deciding what color to buy my H3 in , I start searching the web for information on my soon to be new vehicle I come across this wonderful website . Being a four wheeler with many lifted trucks including and not limited to an Explorer with 8.5 inches of lift and 35" BFGs( miss this one the most ) I like the look of the lifted H3 and read this post as to what went wrong with the Rancho
!st you guys acting like school girls , I suggest getting your own room , This is supposed to be an info site If you dont have anything to contribute to the discussion -SHUT UP !!!
2 ) In the articles I read it does seem 20" wheels where the focus .
3) If your going off road with this and your worried about airing down for traction , but your whining you dont want your paint scratched from the mud and rocks coming from your tires cuz they stick out , WTF kind of wheelin are you doing ???
I wanna go in the mud , BUT I dont want to get dirty ?! HUH !!
I love the look of a lifted truck , I love wheelin in the trails and mud ( I hate cleaning afterwards). But if your gonna wheel , your gettin dirty and your gonna scratch it .
Personally I like the tires to hang out a bit , and yes I cringe every time I hear a rock bounce off the side of my door .
I dont care much for rancho , kinda liked Superlift , and Fabtech , depends on if its 2wd or 4wd , yes Ive lifted 2wds .Right now I have an 03 Ranger 2wd on 33'tires .Why , because it looks bad ass !
Thanks and keep up the good INFO !

Rancho

01-11-2006, 03:30 PM

Hello members!
It has been brought to our (Rancho Suspension) attention a few posts about one of our products. We are in no way trying to say anybody’s opinion is incorrect, we just want a chance to stand behind our product and let the consumers know the facts about our products.

1.) Clearance to Knuckle. When you air down a tire, your clearance from the knuckle will increase and not decrease. The moment when clearance is at the minimum is when a tire is over inflated and has a high impact directly on the tire. The tire will not expand more once a tire is aired down. During our offroad testing, we used 4.75” BS wheels on a 16” wheel. I agree the clearance in that situation is close but it will not hit. The wheel and tire are fixed to the knuckle and the clearance will not change in articulation. A ¼” is a lot more clearance than most other vehicles out on the road. Take a look at any newer Dodge 1500 IFS and realize the aluminum knuckle (which will flex more than a ductile iron knuckle) has less clearance. We would not recommend a wheel and tire combo that, to the best of our knowledge, will not work in all situations including offroading. All of our recommended tire sizes are at 12.50” wide max. If someone picks a wide wheel and wide tire combo outside of our recommended, this may be a different scenario. We do not have enough time to purchase every wheel and tire combination (and different brands) to fit check. Please consult your local wheel and tire specialist and they should be able to help you out. I noticed a response regarding Rancho was contacted for a similar situation and replied with you are to use 20” wheels to clear the knuckle. There is no record of this call and we would be more than happy to look in to this for you.
2.) Tires Sticking Out. We agree that the tires stick out more than OE. To maintain proper caster and camber curves this is mandatory. Rancho does not believe in sacrificing OE geometry and in fact we always try to improve it for offroad handling as well as maintaining the same driver feeling on the road. The two ways to maintain OE geometry are to move the hub section of the knuckle further out (as you increase the upper ball joint neck) or to just increase the upper ball joint neck. By moving the hub section out you can fit OE wheels on, but the end result of track width is exactly the same. I am fairly confident that if you measure the finished front track width they will be the same. Rancho does not believe in moving the hub section out because the end result will be higher forces on the knuckle which could lead to fatigue failure over time.
3.) Highway Speed Stability. We looked at some of the photos of Timgco’s truck and concluded that the torsion bars are cranked too high. The half shafts and the lower control arms are at a greater angle than our vehicle and all the SEMA vehicles we have installed (again, this is assuming from photos, need measurements to be 100%). This will give a result of instability at high speed. The H3 is designed to ride on the OE bumpstops and they act by adding damping and as a light spring. Unless you upgrade the torsion bars, you will have this feeling. When the vehicle is off the bumpstops, it feels like its floating in the air. We noticed this sensation even with a stock vehicle by removing the OE bumpstops. This is the reason why Rancho feels it is very important to reuse the OE bumpstops on this vehicle (especially with 35” tires or any heavy wheel / tire combo). We are disappointed the install shop set the torsion bars to the incorrect height and wish you would have called the Rancho Techline.
4.) Wheel and Tire Sizes. When we do a SEMA project vehicle, we choose a theme. The theme is carried down to the wheel / tire combo as well. What we install on the vehicle is not what the consumer needs to do (and I do apologize if the Techline did in fact tell you this). The management here wanted an adventurous theme to the vehicle and we picked 20” wheels to work with. Since GM and SMA did rugged and outdoors, Dub Air did blingy, we want to give the consumer a different look than the others. If you look at the recommended tire / wheel combo, it does not say anywhere that 20” wheels are required as some posts have reflected. 16”, 17”, and 18” wheels need 4.5” backspacing.
5.) Bumpsteer. Rancho emphasizes on reducing OE bumpsteer while still being able to fit within the same wheel size as OE.
6.) Dropping the Front Differential. We noticed some companies are coming out with kits that do not drop the front differential and giving new half shafts. In our opinion, we do not like this method. Not only does it introduce more moving parts as well as longer install, it creates a new issue for repair 10 years down the road. Most lift kit companies obsolete their kits after the vehicle is more than 10 years old. Specialty replacement parts are not easy to come by after a kit is obsolete. If you plan on taking the kit off as soon at the kits are obsolete this will not be a concern. Rancho thrives to reuse as much OE parts as possible for quick and easy repair. There are not any parts on the Rancho kit that should require maintenance or repair.
7.) Torsion Bar System. Because the torsion bar crossmember is welded to the frame, relocating the torsion bars was not a feasible idea. We noticed (including ours) three different ways companied have pursued this. One company left everything in the same location. Once you see the bending on the torsion bar you realize this could not be good. The other option was a linkage system. The option we picked was a rigid device from Realift. We felt that less moving parts would be less failure, repair, and maintenance while maintaining the same torsional effect. We also used the Realift locator to simplify installation.
Let me reiterate that we are not trying to start controversy, just to back our product. If you have any questions about our product feel free to private message me and we can set up a time to chat. We did 8 vehicles for the SEMA show and each one is a driven daily with no complaints. The H3 is a unique vehicle that not many companies will attempt due to the complexity. We stand behind our products and feel it will be the best available product for a reasonable price. For those who are not aware, this kit did win SEMA Best Offroad Product for 2006. I also ask please do not post reply for bashing the company and giving your personal opinion on a product you are not familiar with. Once again please contact me if you have any questions or comments. We will not be monitoring this post so please use the private messaging.
Rancho

Dan Rather

01-11-2006, 03:38 PM

Rancho products are sub standard. Their shocks have half the half the life that other similarly priced shocks do. Their lifts are barely safe.

And they paid for that SEMA award.http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

timgco

01-11-2006, 03:55 PM

WOW! They replied. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

It would have been nice to have this feedback when I was going through the issues. Their tech dept. was less than helpful to me personally. I'm not syaing Rancho is a compitant company. All I can say it T&)$ in their tech/ installation dept. was less than helpful. It's too bad this kit didn't work out, because I LOVED the look of this kit for the most part. What Rancho commented on the knuckle being close and not touching is tru to an extent. they didn't take into consideration the fact the sidewall of the tire will flex on top alos... not just the buttom. I was able to stuff that knuckle into the sidewall of the tire on an incline and turning. Maybe I had the wrong the wheel setup. ??? All I know is I paid $600 not to have their lift on my truck and did not get the help I should have from Rancho when I needed it.

DRTYFN

01-11-2006, 04:15 PM

6 years ago, when I was researching which lift to put on my '97 Tahoe, I was told by my local non-partisan shop that they had taken off several Rancho lifts because the vehicle owners wanted to replace them with other lifts that were "more reliable". After looking at most lifts on the market I went with Explorer Pro Comp. IMO, theirs was much sturdier, with better welds and better finish. I never had any trouble with that lift.

timgco

01-11-2006, 05:51 PM

Well, I just talked with an individual from Rancho. This is them! We discussed the kit and the issues I had. WIthout them actually seeing the kit while it was on my truck, we cannot pinpoint the highway speed isues, but it was confirmed the rim set up was a large part of the issues with the knuckle/ caliper spacing. The wheel spacer with spline nuts also could have been part of the issue. The individual I talked with was even willing to have the kit reinstalled at their facility at N/C to make things the way they should be. (too bad I'm a few states over). http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif If you have questions/ concerns he's more than willling to talk with people. Send him a PM.

timgco

01-11-2006, 07:39 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Alec W:
Are you going to try having it put back on Tim? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm going to wait until Moab so I can go for a ride in theirs. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

H3Eric

01-11-2006, 08:22 PM

Timgco, I see some references to MOAB but when is the MOAB event happening.

evomind

01-12-2006, 02:14 PM

ive said b4 i havent had the problems timgco had with the rancho kit. i do experience fairly mild steering wheel shake at 40mph, but i think thats a tire issue. its stable at 75-80 mph, etc....i havent aired down so i cant comment on that.
yes, my tires stick out a ways, but when u go up 6 inches or so, i think its a good idea to also go wider.
i would take rancho up on their offer timgco, with the addition that if u dont like it still theyll take it back off.