1000 mile impressions

[afretiree]

We have an adventure, auto, monsoon, tow and XM radio combo and I just wanted to start off the weekend with some highs and lows for the truck. Our previous 4x4's were: 94 Cherokee, 97 Wrangler, 01 LR Disco II.

Lows

1. Rattle in drivers door - will fix 1st oil change
2. Engine vibration around 1200 RPM - see above
3. No room around gas pedal - my Boxster has more room, I am only a size 11 and my boots touch the brake pedal when I am on the gas. It looks like they have a manual brake pedal on an auto vehicle.
4. The seats have too much support in the middle, I seem to sit on top of them and not in them - maybe too used to the Boxster as my wife loves the seats
5. Not enough cubby holes for storage - center arm rest box is very small, nothing overhead.
6. Not enough undercarraige protection. My disco had none but the wrangler was much better. On a serious 4x4 I should not have to spend more $$$.
7. No rocker protection/sliders standard - See # 6
8. No standard side air bags - A casualty of building to an under $30k price point.
9. Lack of torque (bet you thought I would say HP) - My Disco only had 185HP (V8) but felt stronger and downshifted less on gradual interstate roads. A 5 cylinder diesel would be awesome.
10. Cheap plastic door handles/locks, wiper stem - I would have paid a few bucks more for real metal. Were they afraid nobody would buy the truck at $31000 base price?
11. Where the hell is the front end? The hood dips enough to make it hard to tell where everything is - the Wrangler was tops in this category and the Disco not too far behind. Practice will make me more confident.
12. Old fashioned temp controls - the disco (and many other modern vehicles) let you set the temp and forget about it. Another under $30k price-point thing.
13. No locking gas cap standard - See # 12
14. Not enough hand-holds - Ditto
15. Rear view mirror has a chintzy looking cord running to it - I would pay $5 for a finished plastic cover.
16. No place to rest my left arm, door sill is too far away and armrest covered with controls - Disco was no better, Wrangler was perfect.
17. Not composed when hitting potholes and bumps - Disco was much better due to rear coil springs.
18. Whip antenna??? Even Land Rover (with their Lucas legacy) topped this
19. No driver vanity mirror, passenger mirror not lighted!!
20. Rear seat headrests not removable! Results in very poor rear visibility.

Highs
1. Very solid feel for its size, no flex so far - On par with Disco and Wrangler, much better than Cherokee (and Explorer and Grand Cherokees that I rented)
2. Crawl ratio - I could not believe how low it is, cannot imagine what the 5-speed is like. Nothing else comes close except a trials bike.
3. Turning radius, makes me feel like I am sitting on the front wheels - Disco was horrible as was the Cherokee.
4. Efficiency, 17 mpg average so far (regular gas) - Disco sucked (14 MPG premium gas) and the Wrangler (which was much smaller/lighter) never got over 19 highway.
5. Overall handling is very good, offroad and on. Doesn't lean as much as some reviewers indicate. Much better than Disco, Wrangler didn't seem to lean at all, you could really throw it around on the street.
6. Off-road is boring in this truck but that is a good thing. We tried a few steep/off camber/rutted spots and got stuck a few times (dueler tires) but not because of the truck. We went down a hill that would have scraped the front bumper on the Disco but nothing touched on the H3.
7. Value - The Disco went thru $12K in warranty work in 38 months and used premium gas, the scheduled service was outrageous ($35 wiper blades, $200 for spark plugs)
8. Aftermarket support, should be extensive - After about a year of the bling-bling chrome crap we should get some winch bumpers etc
9. Comfortable, an overall feeling when driving day-to-day. Most controls feel solid and in the right place. Spouse loves the seats.
10. Tow hooks.
11. Hydralic assis rear gate.
12. Monsoon radio. Wife loves it, I am not sure about it yet.
13. Partial skid plates standard.
14. Decent tires with adventure package.
15. Confidence-inspiring - The truck feels unbreakable (which may also be a bad thing) when off-road. It just feels like it was made for going off road and not just a street truck with 4 wheel drive added. It took my wife about a year to get used to the Disco quirks.

Lots of the lows can be corrected with aftermarket stuff, I couldn't buy anything to make the Disco more reliable. I know a guy that races 911's and gave up on Land Rovers because of the $$$.
I can see us keeping this truck (unless there is a H3 diesel Alpha) past the payments. This truck is a daily driver for my wife and we are not hard core extremists but we do like going off road. We do not have buyers remorse (except for not getting the power seats) like we did with the LR (lease).

[afretiree]

We have an adventure, auto, monsoon, tow and XM radio combo and I just wanted to start off the weekend with some highs and lows for the truck. Our previous 4x4's were: 94 Cherokee, 97 Wrangler, 01 LR Disco II.

Lows

1. Rattle in drivers door - will fix 1st oil change
2. Engine vibration around 1200 RPM - see above
3. No room around gas pedal - my Boxster has more room, I am only a size 11 and my boots touch the brake pedal when I am on the gas. It looks like they have a manual brake pedal on an auto vehicle.
4. The seats have too much support in the middle, I seem to sit on top of them and not in them - maybe too used to the Boxster as my wife loves the seats
5. Not enough cubby holes for storage - center arm rest box is very small, nothing overhead.
6. Not enough undercarraige protection. My disco had none but the wrangler was much better. On a serious 4x4 I should not have to spend more $$$.
7. No rocker protection/sliders standard - See # 6
8. No standard side air bags - A casualty of building to an under $30k price point.
9. Lack of torque (bet you thought I would say HP) - My Disco only had 185HP (V8) but felt stronger and downshifted less on gradual interstate roads. A 5 cylinder diesel would be awesome.
10. Cheap plastic door handles/locks, wiper stem - I would have paid a few bucks more for real metal. Were they afraid nobody would buy the truck at $31000 base price?
11. Where the hell is the front end? The hood dips enough to make it hard to tell where everything is - the Wrangler was tops in this category and the Disco not too far behind. Practice will make me more confident.
12. Old fashioned temp controls - the disco (and many other modern vehicles) let you set the temp and forget about it. Another under $30k price-point thing.
13. No locking gas cap standard - See # 12
14. Not enough hand-holds - Ditto
15. Rear view mirror has a chintzy looking cord running to it - I would pay $5 for a finished plastic cover.
16. No place to rest my left arm, door sill is too far away and armrest covered with controls - Disco was no better, Wrangler was perfect.
17. Not composed when hitting potholes and bumps - Disco was much better due to rear coil springs.
18. Whip antenna??? Even Land Rover (with their Lucas legacy) topped this
19. No driver vanity mirror, passenger mirror not lighted!!
20. Rear seat headrests not removable! Results in very poor rear visibility.

Highs
1. Very solid feel for its size, no flex so far - On par with Disco and Wrangler, much better than Cherokee (and Explorer and Grand Cherokees that I rented)
2. Crawl ratio - I could not believe how low it is, cannot imagine what the 5-speed is like. Nothing else comes close except a trials bike.
3. Turning radius, makes me feel like I am sitting on the front wheels - Disco was horrible as was the Cherokee.
4. Efficiency, 17 mpg average so far (regular gas) - Disco sucked (14 MPG premium gas) and the Wrangler (which was much smaller/lighter) never got over 19 highway.
5. Overall handling is very good, offroad and on. Doesn't lean as much as some reviewers indicate. Much better than Disco, Wrangler didn't seem to lean at all, you could really throw it around on the street.
6. Off-road is boring in this truck but that is a good thing. We tried a few steep/off camber/rutted spots and got stuck a few times (dueler tires) but not because of the truck. We went down a hill that would have scraped the front bumper on the Disco but nothing touched on the H3.
7. Value - The Disco went thru $12K in warranty work in 38 months and used premium gas, the scheduled service was outrageous ($35 wiper blades, $200 for spark plugs)
8. Aftermarket support, should be extensive - After about a year of the bling-bling chrome crap we should get some winch bumpers etc
9. Comfortable, an overall feeling when driving day-to-day. Most controls feel solid and in the right place. Spouse loves the seats.
10. Tow hooks.
11. Hydralic assis rear gate.
12. Monsoon radio. Wife loves it, I am not sure about it yet.
13. Partial skid plates standard.
14. Decent tires with adventure package.
15. Confidence-inspiring - The truck feels unbreakable (which may also be a bad thing) when off-road. It just feels like it was made for going off road and not just a street truck with 4 wheel drive added. It took my wife about a year to get used to the Disco quirks.

Lots of the lows can be corrected with aftermarket stuff, I couldn't buy anything to make the Disco more reliable. I know a guy that races 911's and gave up on Land Rovers because of the $$$.
I can see us keeping this truck (unless there is a H3 diesel Alpha) past the payments. This truck is a daily driver for my wife and we are not hard core extremists but we do like going off road. We do not have buyers remorse (except for not getting the power seats) like we did with the LR (lease).

[Mr Hank]

As a former Land Rover owner I am loving my H3 in every way. Land Rover makes a fine vehicle when it runs but my 2003 SE3 Freelander NEVER ran longet than a month without it being taken or towed in to the shop. The purchase of my H# goes like this. My Land Rover was giving me trouble once again, the check engine light was on and the motor barely running. I was taking my car into the dealer for year another 2 week repair session when the engine light went out! Since the Land Rover dealership and the Hummer dealer are relatively close to one another I pulled in to look at the h3 one more time. They had the exact model that I wanted on the lot and only checked the milage and general condition of the car. I was sweating bullets that they were going to check the car out with the dealer. This was one time where going to an american car dealership backfired on them. They were so anxious to sell the Hummer that they gave me Blue book for it and 2 hours later I drove out with my new H3.
I kind miss the my Land Rover but the H3 is superior in every way. And now with 2400 miles on it it has yet to have a problem.

I think Hummer is going to put the final nail in Land Rovers coffin.

[f5fstop]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
3. No room around gas pedal - my Boxster has more room, I am only a size 11 and my boots touch the brake pedal when I am on the gas. It looks like they have a manual brake pedal on an auto vehicle.
4. The seats have too much support in the middle, I seem to sit on top of them and not in them - maybe too used to the Boxster as my wife loves the seats
5. Not enough cubby holes for storage - center arm rest box is very small, nothing overhead.
6. Not enough undercarraige protection. My disco had none but the wrangler was much better. On a serious 4x4 I should not have to spend more $$$.
7. No rocker protection/sliders standard - See # 6
8. No standard side air bags - A casualty of building to an under $30k price point.
10. Cheap plastic door handles/locks, wiper stem - I would have paid a few bucks more for real metal. Were they afraid nobody would buy the truck at $31000 base price?
11. Where the hell is the front end? The hood dips enough to make it hard to tell where everything is - the Wrangler was tops in this category and the Disco not too far behind. Practice will make me more confident.
12. Old fashioned temp controls - the disco (and many other modern vehicles) let you set the temp and forget about it. Another under $30k price-point thing.
13. No locking gas cap standard - See # 12
14. Not enough hand-holds - Ditto
16. No place to rest my left arm, door sill is too far away and armrest covered with controls - Disco was no better, Wrangler was perfect.

18. Whip antenna??? Even Land Rover (with their Lucas legacy) topped this

20. Rear seat headrests not removable! Results in very poor rear visibility.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Have to agree with your highs, but would like to comment about some of the lows:
3. I have to agree. With my dress shoes on, all is ok, but with my tennis shoes on, I hit the edge of the brake pedal often when putting my foot on the accelerator pedal.
4. I agree, but that is the design of the seat. My Vette wrapped around my rear, and I sat low in the seat.
5. Did you pull the insert out of the center console? There is a lot of room under that black insert to put stuff. It's plastic inside so some items might rattle, but something like a cloth CD case should fit. Just noticed this yesterday. For me, this vehicle has a ton more storage in the immediate front passenger area, than either of my last two vehicles. With the Vette, the console was only 2" deep, so it was worthless, and the glove box was filled up with the owner's manual, and there was no place else to put anything, except to throw into the rear hatch area. The Wrangler is not much better, it did have decent size glove box, and I replaced the console with a Tuffy Steel console which gave me a giant console to put stuff in. It did have small compartments in the doors.
6. This one baffles me. I have a '03 Wrangler and this offers more protection than what the Wrangler had from the factory. In fact, it has a front shield that protects the steering, something the Wrangler did not have. I find for most off-roading most people will do, the undercarriage protection is more than adequate, for those like me, I will pay the extra dollars for more protection. Have to remember, at least 50 percent will never see any hard off-roading, so why should they pay for it. One solution would be to include these items on the off-road package, at least the rocker protectors and the undercarriage protection grid.
7. See item 6.
8. Agree they are not available, but not sure if I would want them anyway. Personal....
10. Metal is going out due to having to pass crash tests. Plastic breaks during an impact, metal does not. Can't remember the last vehicle I have had that had actual metal parts like this.
11. Design, but something you should have realized when purchasing the vehicle. It is hard to determine where the front end, ends. I agree, the wrangler was great for me, so long as I remembered I had a Hi-Lift Jack attached to the front bumper. Makes it safer to other parked cars, I seem to park about three feet from other cars and objects. Guess someday I will learn exactly where that front end, ends.
12. Personally, I love the temp controls, the size, the texture, same with the radio. Why? Well, in my Jeep, the aftermarket radio controls were smaller and when bouncing around on rough MI roads, or off-road, I could not change the station since the buttons were too dang small to grab while bouncing. Now these large ones are easy to grab and turn. Some will love 'em, some will hate 'em. (Might have something to do with age too.)
13. Never had a car shipped from the factory with a locking gas cap.
14. It would be nice to have one on the driver's side. Heck there is one for the front passenger, and four in the back. It would have been nice to have one on the A-pillar for the driver; especially a short one.
16. I'm 6.2" and rest my arm on the door rest quite well, as well as resting it on the window sill if open. I would like to have seen the switches moved a bit forward. My Wrangler was ok, but those metal rods, used to hold the plastic window frame in place, were a pain in the elbow at times.
18. For good radio reception in outlying areas, a window antenna needs to have some horizontal pitch, or a super large surface. Those window antennas that do not have this, tend to be weak in outlying areas. Personally, I like the whip antenna. (Although I have to admit, if it fell off I would not miss it, since I only listen to XM.)
20. I agree, would have been nice, or at least the flip-down types that GM has one some vehicles.

[HummerJim]

We are back in Haines Junction after a WONDERFUL week in spite of all the rain,wind and low clouds at Kluane National Park. One of the best parts of being retired is you can stay places as long as you want. Kluane was fantastic, it reminds me of Banff or Yellowstone only you can go all day and not see another person or car - you feel like a real explorer! The mountains remind me of Estes Park, Colorado, only higher and with no one else around. This place has more wildlife than most zoos, with moose, caribou, dool horn sheep (lots of them), grizzlies (we've seen either two or three blonde or black bears everyday), and bald eagles a daily sight. Because of the cloud cover we never saw Mt. Logan http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif. The moose are EVERYWHERE at Kluane, including the roads. Many of the roads are gravel/mud in the park, but our H3 had no problems even going up the steep summit grade on a rainy morning. We took the drive up to Destruction Bay and met the couple in their H2 that had been at the Canadian border crossing with us a month ago and we both pulled over and talked with each other, they had been up to Dawson and loved it and back already. I think there's a certain camaraderie among Hummer owners like Corvette or Jeep Wrangler owners. He would LOVE to be getting the 17/18mpg we have been averaging. With over 12,800 miles on the odometer we have yet to have any problems, except for our starred headlight cover from the rocks - the windshield is still unscathed. My overall impression is of a rugged vehicle that is great offroad and comfortable on the highway. For the 33,900 we paid, I feel this is a lot of vehicle with more capability than I first thought, and I'm very pleased with the reliability and lack of little problems - still don't feel any buzz in the accelerator pedal like others. On a 1C day up here we got our first low tire pressure warning, but it went away after 5 minutes of driving and after the trails we took in Kluane I probably need to check the tire pressure anyway. I am 6 ft 4 and have no problems with my arm resting on the side or sill, but with size 14 shoes I agree about the brake pedal being a little close and I'd like to see the window lift switches moved forward. I give the cloth seats an A++ for comfort and the monsoon an A too. We have so much JUNK in the back, the backseats almost lie flat now and I have been relegated to using my outside mirrors due to my wife's inability to resist a bargain and a gift shop owner's dream customer. I love the heater controls because they are easy to use, I can read them without my glasses on, and wearing gloves doesn't make them difficult to use. Some of things you mentioned would be nice, but it would then be a $43,000 plus vehicle and not nearly the following it has now or the aftermarket equipment (I still want someone to come out with a good/easy to install winch). I don't even notice the power issue anymore, and I find it more than adequate and comfortable on the highway and A+ offroad - after owning 8 4X4s I can say that NEVER seems to go hand in hand as well as it does on the H3. When you're in the middle of nowhere on mud and gravel roads, the H3 inspires confidence. Tomorrow we are back to Whitehorse and start our drive up to Carmacks and Dawson City and maybe, depending on the weather, a little further north.

[f5fstop]

Good to see you are having fun. I'm envious as hell....but I have to say, "Where are the PICTURES, Jim?"http://hometown.aol.com/f5fstop01/images/cheers.gif

It is quite obvious that you are having way too much fun. http://hometown.aol.com/f5fstop01/images/jumpingsmileys.gif

[canucksnaphook]

Come on Jim...where are the freakin pictures?? This is prolly as close as I will get to that far up north so please feel free to share with us. great to hear the H3 is doing so well !! enjoy the rest of the trip !!

C.

[afretiree]

F5FSTOP

5. Thanks for pointing this out, there is quite a bit of room when you pull out the insert.
7. The H-2's I looked at all had standard rocker protection.
10. My 2001 Disco, and my wifes mercedes had metal door pulls on the inside.
13. Three of the last four vehicles we owned have locking (from inside the vehicle) gas cap covers.

I don't see these as serious flaws or I wouldn't have bought the truck in the first place. The overall finish is very good but it seems like they cut a few corners to keep the price down. But don't get me started on the wimpy horn. I have heard louder horns on motorcycles.

[f5fstop]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by afretiree:
F5FSTOP

5. Thanks for pointing this out, there is quite a bit of room when you pull out the insert.
7. The H-2's I looked at all had standard rocker protection.
10. My 2001 Disco, and my wifes mercedes had metal door pulls on the inside.
13. Three of the last four vehicles we owned have locking (from inside the vehicle) gas cap covers.

I don't see these as serious flaws or I wouldn't have bought the truck in the first place. The overall finish is very good but it seems like they cut a few corners to keep the price down. But don't get me started on the wimpy horn. I have heard louder horns on motorcycles. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ok, I got mixed up on terminology, I was thinking "gas cap," not "gas cap covers." Both of my Vettes had/have locking gas covers, opening from the inside. Guess I'm so used to them I forgot about 'em.
I compare the Hummer to my soon to be departed Jeep (I hope). Same type of fuel cap, and open design.
That extra room in the console was found by mistake. It might be mentioned in the owner's manual, but I don't remember reading about it.