Re: Need some help and effort
 

The verdict is still out on this.

It's not dramatic but the distance from the bottom of the frame rail to the tie rod on some is less than it is on others. My deduction is that there is something that causes the idler arm to move the centerlink to a higher position than "normal". This causes the tie rod to be up closer to the bottom of the frame rail. When forces are applied as in the toe-in situations, the tie rod is actually hitting the frame rail on some rigs.

On mine, it would have to move a total of 4 inches for this to occur, which is, I doubt, not in spec for the vertical movement of the centerlink. But mine DOES NOT, nor does it exhibit the type of toe-in that others do. And I've noticed that some trucks are more prone to toe-in than others.

Before I think most of us just chalked it up to wheeling, but when I saw Phil's truck put into the toe-in position and he was able to hold it there while I looked at the position of the tie rods and centerlink, it's obvious the tie-rod gets past the proper angle and "pushes" on the centerlink causing it to rotate and flex. This due in part to the bends at the end of the centerlink but also, on some trucks because on the PS the Tie rod angle in reference to the CL to the knuckle is more severe.

I've noticed that the bracket that my idler bolts to is not square to the frame part that it is welded to. The top part is actually pushed a little towards the rear compared to the bottom of it. This would position mine so that the idler arm would be lower and hold the centerlink lower.

Phil and I discussed the possibility of the idler arms being differing angles and/or lengths also. But as soon as I get through doing some things to mine and can get to the dealership, I am going to see if I can find one where the tie rod is "up" and try to compare to mind to see where the difference lies and if this has anything to do with anything.

The tie rods were a major and total weak link, the centerlink is another and needs to be changed, but there are situations such as mine (where I rarely lose alignment after wheeling) that makes me wonder if there is not something else that's contributing that would be a simple fix.

Of course, all of this only really shows on trucks that are wheeled fairly hard and regular.

Wow. I know my '03 H2 NEVER went out of alignment in 50k miles. This one goes out driving down the road if I hit a bump or hump where the weight is lifted off the front end. I couldn't figure out why in the world this car would be so much different. I got the dealership to replace an idler arm, but they swear up and down that the pitman is fine. I replaced the centerlink after the last Moab trip and, of course, the tie rods are new.:rolleyes:
Lift the front of your truck, the front wheels droop because the weight is off of them. The centerlink is rotated and the tie rod knuckle flexes too. If the shocks are soft (or in this case, soft on the extension, stiff on the compression) the centerlink will let the wheels droop a LOT farther. This extra extension is one reason I got rid of the Rod Hall racing shocks. I had a brand new loaner H2 and put it up on a rack and the centerlink barely moved. I drove it off road, and the steering wheel didn't bob back and forth going over the bumps. I'm still not sure if the shocks were the cause of some of the alignment problems but with the extra travel it couldn't hurt to take them off and try something else. I put the Ranchos on and went back East and wheeled at Paragon and came home, and the tires aren't showing any signs of wear or feathering after 7000 miles. No pulling left issues like I had before, and the steering wheel is still straight. I've had lots of weird alignment gremlins.
I hope all that makes some sense.:o
Please keep me posted on this would ya?:) If you'd like Trent to measure anything on mine, just let me know.

Re: Need some help and effort
 

I think I just need to do like Paragon and measure against a new car. I can even measure against my g'friends that is not wheeled that much.

Re: Need some help and effort
 

[quote=PhilD]The easiest way is to jack up just one front wheel and grab it on the sides and see if there is any free play, there shouldn't be. While you are at it, try for free play top to bottom, which would indicate a potential ball joint problem. Most alignment places are pretty good at detecting a problem in the steering, as they can't do an alignment properly if there is any free play. The dealership insists its all tight, and they kept aligning it.

That sounds like soft shocks, great for a comfy ride, within reason anyway, but not bvery good for positive handling.They worked great on washboards at high speed. The tires would skip off the top making for a great ride. Definitely Rally type shocks. [/quote] Thanks for the advise, I'll check out the steering.