STS is excited to become a Sponsor of the Hummer Forums.

Our goal in becoming a sponsor is to let people know there is another option for adding power to their H2 and be here to answer any questions or concerns that you may have.

All of the information about the system is on our website. http://www.ststurbo.com

Key stats are at 5 psi we saw the following results:

Rear Wheel Horsepower: 316
%'d increase: 60%

Rear Wheel Torque: 350
%'d increase: 46%

You may have seen the actual dyno run on the Guns and Gears TV Show.

Most people don't believe a remote mounted turbo system will work. The biggest questions are around turbo lag and the air filter location. The fact is that is does work. We've got hundreds of happy customers.

This system achieves full boost by 3000 rpm in first gear. Turbos are load dependent, so on the free way in higher gears the boost comes on sooner, usually before 2000 rpm. I personally have a 6.0L truck with the remote mounted system on it. I've turned up the boost and get 7 psi by 3000 rpm. Besides the power, the coolest part about the system is the sound it makes. You get a deep V8 rumble combined with the turbo spool.

Check out the testimonial section of the site to see responses from our customers.

Air filter location is not an issue for normal everyday driving. It comes with a Outerwears Drycharger Sock that sheds water. All of our test vehicles are everyday drivers and we drive them all winter long in Utah. For those of you that take your H2 offroad, the solution is very simple. We sell a snorkel hose kit that relocates the air filter above wheel level.

For $5195 this system comes complete with tuning and fuel system upgrades.

If you have any questions, I'll watch the forum and do my best to get you timely responses.

Thanks!

Ben @ STS

STS is excited to become a Sponsor of the Hummer Forums.

Our goal in becoming a sponsor is to let people know there is another option for adding power to their H2 and be here to answer any questions or concerns that you may have.

All of the information about the system is on our website. http://www.ststurbo.com

Key stats are at 5 psi we saw the following results:

Rear Wheel Horsepower: 316
%'d increase: 60%

Rear Wheel Torque: 350
%'d increase: 46%

You may have seen the actual dyno run on the Guns and Gears TV Show.

Most people don't believe a remote mounted turbo system will work. The biggest questions are around turbo lag and the air filter location. The fact is that is does work. We've got hundreds of happy customers.

This system achieves full boost by 3000 rpm in first gear. Turbos are load dependent, so on the free way in higher gears the boost comes on sooner, usually before 2000 rpm. I personally have a 6.0L truck with the remote mounted system on it. I've turned up the boost and get 7 psi by 3000 rpm. Besides the power, the coolest part about the system is the sound it makes. You get a deep V8 rumble combined with the turbo spool.

Check out the testimonial section of the site to see responses from our customers.

Air filter location is not an issue for normal everyday driving. It comes with a Outerwears Drycharger Sock that sheds water. All of our test vehicles are everyday drivers and we drive them all winter long in Utah. For those of you that take your H2 offroad, the solution is very simple. We sell a snorkel hose kit that relocates the air filter above wheel level.

For $5195 this system comes complete with tuning and fuel system upgrades.

If you have any questions, I'll watch the forum and do my best to get you timely responses.

Thanks!

Ben @ STS

Hey Ben, welcome to the forum. Many expressed interest in your product when Jonahs was working with you. He really hoped for a group buy deal. Obviously that didn't workout.

Anyway, I know he had some issues with the system, among others, after installation. How did things turn out? We might as well hear your side of it before some folks start putting money up for your product.

And whatever happened with Rick? I know he was talking with you extensively, before choosing something else.

FWIW, I'm not going after you in some vindictive way. Many were left hanging without all the info. I'm asking you to straighten it all out. Thanks.

What are the advantages for this system other then cooler running turbo inlet?

Ben, I just thought of a couple of other things I'm sure you can help me with. What happened with the guy in Dallas? How did you get the info from him, exactly?

Did you get the injector size right yet? I know that was an issue with the first one you sent out the door. As you know, fuel is very important and shorting it could cause a failure. One that would be hard to prove exactly what caused it.

A big selling point for your kit is it's ease of installation and you really promote that. I think that's great. Unlike the supercharger which is hard to install and most don't do it themselves, I bet most guys will try to install your setup themselves. Of course, then their warranty is null and void. How is that relayed to them in a manner that removes all ambiguity?

KenP,

Thanks for your posts.

First, on the group buy - we are not against trying to get something going on a group buy. We only sell through our STS Power Dealers, so I'll talk with our VP of Sales and figure out what we can do.

With Jonahs, the only thing I will say is that oiling system was installed incorrectly. We've had many customers with the 6.0L engine running for over a year with no issues, including my truck, which was the first 6.0L truck.

At the time that Rick wanted a H2 kit, we did not have one available and our R&D schedule was full. It was simply a business decision to work on sports cars before the H2. We didn't have what Rick wanted, so he made a different decision on forced induction. I would have done the same thing as him.

I'm not sure who you are talking about in Dallas. I'll need more info - e-mail me more information and I'll find out if there is an issue.

In terms of injectors we use the same injectors that we use on all the 6.0L engines. 42# injectors. All the feedback I've seen on the prototype vehicle and the first kits is that A/F ratios are great.

I'm not sure I understand the warranty question. We highly recommend that one of our Power Dealers install the system to receive the 12 month system parts warranty.

Hopefully that answers that round of questions sufficiently. Let me know if you have any other questions...

Thanks!

Ben

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by H2GuyPerson:
What are the advantages for this system other then cooler running turbo inlet? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

H2GuyPerson,

Here's what I see as the benefits of going with a remote mount setup on the H2.

1. Efficient performance in the usable RPM range - Turbos are more efficient than superchargers are building horsepower/torque. On the H2 it totally wakes it up and makes it a blast to drive around town. On the freeway you'll gain 2-4 mpg which is very difficult to do with a supercharger.

2. Emissions legal - a custom turbo setup would be very difficult to get CARB certification. We've recieved our test memo and have a testing date with the CARB lab this month. I expect a CARB EO number within the next couple months. We expected this a year ago, but had contracted with a company that didn't deliver. We now have a direct contact with CARB and feel a lot more confident in our understanding of the CARB Exemption order process and our ability to get the EO#.

3. The sound of the vehicle is awesome. I know I'm biased, but the whine of the supercharger always there is not my favorite thing. I love the V8 rumble, turbo spool and blow off sound on our vehicles.

4. The power is there when you want it. Idling and putting around town you would hardly know that the turbo is there. When you want the power at a stop light, on ramp or passing you've got full boost by 3000 rpms in first gear. It is like having a bottle of nitrous on demand.

5. It is easy to do maintenance on your vehicle. There is more room in the engine bay after the system is installed than before. Changing spark plugs, etc is still easy to do and won't cost you in extra time at the mechanic.

That is why I would buy the system. After driving around my 6.0L truck for a year now, I can't imagine driving without it. I love my commute and anytime I can get in the truck. It just makes driving fun.

Hope that helps...

Ben

The posting of a STS'ed H2 dyno sheet would be nice. A/F ratio would help also. Lastly, please specify which type of dyno is being used and whether its an awd or 2wd unit.

The dyno, along with customer testimonials, pricing, etc. is all on the website.

http://www.ststurbo.com/hummer_h2

However, I've attached the scanned in dyno page to this message. Unfortunately it doesn't have the A/F ratio. Rick Squires, who tuned the vehicle, said it was in the low 11's.

The dyno run was done on an all wheel drive Mustang Dyno at Modern Garage in Murray, UT. You can call Christian at Modern Garage if you would like to verify. 801-262-4605.

Thanks for the question!

Ben

Thanks for answering those. I have more:

The K&N you supply chaffs on the brake lines and the fuel filler hose. Have you fixed that yet? And if so, how did you fix it? I'd hate to see some deadly problem caused by that.

Also, the issue of the rock rails. Many guys and gals on this forum use their trucks offroad. Your design requires cutting the rail supports subsantially to install, thus rendering one nearly useless. Have you fixed this problem yet? And how have you fixed it?

Could you post pics of the system installed on an H2? Both the underside and engine bay.<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Posted by Turbo H2:
With Jonahs, the only thing I will say is that oiling system was installed incorrectly. We've had many customers with the 6.0L engine running for over a year with no issues, including my truck, which was the first 6.0L truck. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>You said the oiling system wasn't installed correctly on his truck. Hard to prove problem, I'm sure. How, exactly, was it determined that was the problem? Dealer inspection or some other method? Since his was one of, if not the first, H2 with your system, how did you assist in the install? And more importantly, how did you assist in the repair?

Can't wait to see the dyno sheets. Thanks again.

OOOps, you snuck the sheet in while I was typing. Thanks and it looks good.

All i will say about My situation and not mention the dealer as He is a very good man and I do not want to cause Him any problems

But, He and I approached STS to do R@D for H2. I would cover labor and asked STS several times to just furnish the parts. At the end STS would have had a H2 kit last summer.
The reply We got, was not going to do an H2 no market and then another response of not only are We not doing a kit for H2 We will never do one for H2 because there is not enough market there. My response was that Hummer owners spend more money to upgrade everything about their ride than most other vehicles on the road. They have the extra income to do that and that there is a market.

I was told that Your were covered up making
f body kits, did not have time to mess with it. The thing is We did not ask You to mess with it just willing provide the parts and I would cover R@D labor for the dealer. Seemed like a very fair deal to Me. I also offered to promote the turbo once i had it on for a little while to make sure all the bugs were worked out to where it would be a finished product.
So bottom line is I would have been running an STS system for a very long time by now. Instead I had a sponsor for My show H2 that furnished Me with a Magnuson supercharger to be recognised as a sponsor at shows because they saw how aggressive i was at winning whether I had sponsors or just spending My money. I would have had it on when I won the state Hummer title a while back. Not only could I have let the forum members know about it and many would have already been running STS as well but, I could have had every judge at every show looking at the STS system and not counting how many spectators would have been seeing it with a mirror underneath to show it off.

All i can say is it showed a narrow mind or tunnel vision a well as poor ability to judge a market and not taking advice from a person who knew what the market looked like.
That is all i will say as it is water under the bridge and I have moved on.
TAZ

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Posted by Turbo H2:
With Jonahs, the only thing I will say is that oiling system was installed incorrectly. We've had many customers with the 6.0L engine running for over a year with no issues, including my truck, which was the first 6.0L truck. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Did you have to design the oiling system different for the H2 than from the other 6.0L trucks?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by RLTAZH2:
All i will say about My situation and not mention the dealer as He is a very good man and I do not want to cause Him any problems

But, He and I approached STS to do R@D for H2. I would cover labor and asked STS several times to just furnish the parts. At the end STS would have had a H2 kit last summer.
The reply We got, was not going to do an H2 no market and then another response of not only are We not doing a kit for H2 We will never do one for H2 because there is not enough market there. My response was that Hummer owners spend more money to upgrade everything about their ride than most other vehicles on the road. They have the extra income to do that and that there is a market.

I was told that Your were covered up making
f body kits, did not have time to mess with it. The thing is We did not ask You to mess with it just willing provide the parts and I would cover R@D labor for the dealer. Seemed like a very fair deal to Me. I also offered to promote the turbo once i had it on for a little while to make sure all the bugs were worked out to where it would be a finished product.
So bottom line is I would have been running an STS system for a very long time by now. Instead I had a sponsor for My show H2 that furnished Me with a Magnuson supercharger to be recognised as a sponsor at shows because they saw how aggressive i was at winning whether I had sponsors or just spending My money. I would have had it on when I won the state Hummer title a while back. Not only could I have let the forum members know about it and many would have already been running STS as well but, I could have had every judge at every show looking at the STS system and not counting how many spectators would have been seeing it with a mirror underneath to show it off.

All i can say is it showed a narrow mind or tunnel vision a well as poor ability to judge a market and not taking advice from a person who knew what the market looked like.
That is all i will say as it is water under the bridge and I have moved on.
TAZ </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Taz,

I apologize if that is the way it was communicated to you. The salesperson that covered your area is no longer with the company.

It was not communicated to me in the way you described. We do sell a universal kit and absolutely would have let you take on the project had I known the details.

We always knew there was a market for the H2, but we have limited resources and have to prioritize R&D projects.

Thanks,

Ben

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Posted by Turbo H2:
With Jonahs, the only thing I will say is that oiling system was installed incorrectly. We've had many customers with the 6.0L engine running for over a year with no issues, including my truck, which was the first 6.0L truck. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Did you have to design the oiling system different for the H2 than from the other 6.0L trucks? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No, the oiling system is the same.

Ben

Hell on the SUT you probably go through the bed and have almost a roof level snorkle set-up which would grab alot of cold air. Depending on the aerodynamics of the roof you could setup some kind of forced induction to make up for the pressure lost on the length of the snorkel tube.

Ben-

Thanks for the response. The dyno sheet looks promising. Although I hate to see a "one question answered, 2 more asked" thread happen, I would like to know how the auto tranny stayed in gear at full throttle w/o kicking down to the next lowest gear on the dyno run. If i give my H2 full throttle at 2400 rpm, it always kicks to the next lower gear.

Again, thanks for the info and Q/A session...

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Mr. I - Man:
Hell on the SUT you probably go through the bed and have almost a roof level snorkle set-up which would grab alot of cold air. Depending on the aerodynamics of the roof you could setup some kind of forced induction to make up for the pressure lost on the length of the snorkel tube. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


You sir are one sick puppy ...You mean kinda like the old Pontiac Fiero GT scoop that mounted over the roofline to catch air into the mid-engine's air box?

Na kinda like those Isuzu Box Trucks

Not sick at all, just sometimes I go off on Adderall induced tangents every once in awhile!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by KenP:
Thanks for answering those. I have more:

The K&N you supply chaffs on the brake lines and the fuel filler hose. Have you fixed that yet? And if so, how did you fix it? I'd hate to see some deadly problem caused by that.

Also, the issue of the rock rails. Many guys and gals on this forum use their trucks offroad. Your design requires cutting the rail supports subsantially to install, thus rendering one nearly useless. Have you fixed this problem yet? And how have you fixed it?

Could you post pics of the system installed on an H2? Both the underside and engine bay.<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Posted by Turbo H2:
With Jonahs, the only thing I will say is that oiling system was installed incorrectly. We've had many customers with the 6.0L engine running for over a year with no issues, including my truck, which was the first 6.0L truck. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>You said the oiling system wasn't installed correctly on his truck. Hard to prove problem, I'm sure. How, exactly, was it determined that was the problem? Dealer inspection or some other method? Since his was one of, if not the first, H2 with your system, how did you assist in the install? And more importantly, how did you assist in the repair?

Can't wait to see the dyno sheets. Thanks again. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The K&N issue you talk about is addressed in the instruction manual. There is a bracket that must be bent so that the filter does not rub on the brake lines.

We did not know that our first H2 had aftermarket rails, there wasn't an issue. We received feedback from one of the dealers that they had to make a notch in the stock rail, but they didn't have to cut the rail support. We will get a stock H2, take a look at the severity of the issue and come up with a fix.

I don't want to comment on Jonah's issue as we were not given a chance to talk with him, only his attorney. We tried many times and wish we could talk with him and work to a win-win, but that is not the case. I'm sure you can appreciate for legal reasons why I cannot say more than this...

We have hundreds of other happy customers that love their systems. If needed, we can provide you with customers that are willing to comment on their positive experience with STS. The testimonials section of our website are submitted from customers as well. http://www.ststurbo.com/testimonials

Thanks!

Ben

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Fastest H-Town Realtor:
Ben-

Thanks for the response. The dyno sheet looks promising. Although I hate to see a "one question answered, 2 more asked" thread happen, I would like to know how the auto tranny stayed in gear at full throttle w/o kicking down to the next lowest gear on the dyno run. If i give my H2 full throttle at 2400 rpm, it always kicks to the next lower gear.

Again, thanks for the info and Q/A session... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Fastest H-Town Realtor,

Thanks for your post, is there a better way that you'd like to see me answer the questions? I'm not a forum veteran, I'll do whatever works best for you guys...

Rick was in the H2 on the dyno pull. He said that Christian started off about 1/2 throttle at 2000 rpm and then pushed the pedal down to WOT at about 3000 rpm. He believes it was a 2nd gear pull.

Hope that answers your question.

Ben

Thanks, I do understand why you can't address that one issue.

You didn't mention the fuel filler hose. Does the filter still rub that? The bending of the bracket part: Is there anyway around bending the bracket? I ask because I've been told you can't really bend it far enough to avoid the chaffing.

When I said "rails" I meant the small ones just under the body, not the side steps. I just want to make sure we're on the same page with that. Is that what you meant, also? I mention it because some like to beef their's up a bit and by cutting them the structure is entirely weakened.

Thanks for your help.

It shouldn't rub the fuel filler hose if installed correctly. The bracket is not an issue. They don't have to be moved very far. Here's the installed pic from the rear. There are a bunch of other pics posted on our website at the following URL:

http://www.ststurbo.com/h2_installation_pictures

We are on the same page on the small rails. We'll get a stock one in here and take a look at it.

Thanks!

Ben

Thanks for the reply but I meant what advantage over a normal turbo setup does this have? So you end up with 12 ft of pipe for the inlet?

Wouldnt having a turbo that far have increased turbo lag? And wouldnt it have to work harder to compress that much air in that much tubing?

Here's my view of why someone would choose a remote mount over a traditional turbo system.

1. Cost - if a front mount kit is available, it generally costs more money and will cost more to install. I've searched around a little bit and the only turbo system I could find for the H2 was one in R&D that was selling for $10,500. Generally turbo systems are custom jobs that cost a ton of money.

2. Heat - The other downside of a custom front mount kit is that it is difficult to find a location where the glowing turbo won't melt other components in your engine compartment. When we visited with Kenny Duttweiler he said that many times he's seen people melt the fluid container for the master and get brake fluid everywhere.

3. Emissions - it is more difficult to pass emissions with the turbos in front of the cats. They take heat away from the cats, so the cats take longer to fire up.

In terms of performance I don't have any data of our system vs. a front mount. We generally get just as good of gains in horsepower and torque and we get full boost by 3000 rpm. The H2 engine is pumping out a lot of exhaust gases. When you turn a hose on that is full of water, water immediately starts coming out the other end. It is the same with air. When we did the calculations it takes about .05 seconds to move enough air to charge the intake pipe on a v8 engine. I'll try to get some of our customers to post on the board. Lag is just not an issue, especially with such a big, heavy vehicle. People like to debate this forever and start going back to their physics classes, but the bottom line is that it works.

If you've got a ton of money, time and willingness to do a custom setup then you'll be happy with a front mounted system. If you want to get the best value for horsepower then you can't beat our system.

Hope that helps!

Ben

Thanks for the reply. Frankly, I think it's scary close. Since no two vehicles come off the line the same, (just read any thread here ) I am worried about the relationship of the filter to the lines and filler hose. It looks awefully close. Some of these guys wheel their trucks every weekend and I can see a rubbing problem occuring. A couple of good, solid smacks across the rearend may hit something.

In the pic you posted the truck is clearly held up by the frame. With the truck on the ground, what is the clearance between the pumpkin and the turbo?

I asked about the warranty earlier. Your site states; http://www.ststurbo.com/products :<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> STS(tm) Turbocharger Systems are designed so that they can be installed with average mechanical ability and without the need for specialty tools. Most systems can be installed in 4-6 hours by first time installers. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>That's on your first, and only, page of products. So I click on: http://www.ststurbo.com/h2_what_s_included
and get this:<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Garrett Turbo GT67
TiAL Wastegate
K&N Air filter and PreCharger
Turbo Oiling System
HPC coated intake tubing
HPC coating exhaust tubing
Electrical harness
PCV System
Silicon connectors, clamps and fittings
Return oil cap
Full color, step-by-step instruction manual
1 year parts warranty
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>I need a clear answer on your warranty. Do you warrant the product if I install it myself? What if there is a problem that can't clearly be determined what the cause was? Where is the link where I can see what type of warranty I get if I pay someone else to do it?

It's nice to see you use Garrett. They're top notch. I'm not familiar with your wastegate company, but I'm sure they're fine. I've installed and used Deltagate many times.

I understand Allen Nelson has his stuff together. I've heard nothing but positive things about him and his TX company.

If the truck I posted a pic of below, that came from your sited, is the one you're referring to on the rails, well, it's not the same. I can't see rock rails on that truck.

I look forward to your responses to my inquiries. Thanks.

Great concept in most applications. I can't imagine you'll find many H2 owners willing to cripple their vehicles off roading abilities with that impossible filter location. The entire system, turbo, filter, tubing, etc., are WAY too vulnerable. This is all that keeps me from buying today.

I guess you can ignore my warranty questions if you want. I found this after looking around your site for awhile http://www.ststurbo.com/refund_warranty_policies :<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Squires Turbo Systems is not responsible for any damage to your vehicle caused by the turbo system or any other components. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Unless, of course, there is something else there you can elaborate on.

You mention Kenny Duttweiler in a previous post. Did he help you with your product? Just curious because I used a few of his products in the late '80's when I was running a Buick GN. My best was a 10.17 @ 135. Never enough to be anywhere near his league. He, Conley, Bell, D'Alesandro and some others were the names back then in Turbos. Especially turbo Buicks.

Anyway, of course a poorly engineered turbo setup could melt the master cylinder. Hell, it could melt a lot more than that. So this statement<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> When we visited with Kenny Duttweiler he said that many times he's seen people melt the fluid container for the master and get brake fluid everywhere. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>doesn't really mean alot. A heatshield should be plenty with a well engineered kit.

You said this:<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Cost - if a front mount kit is available, it generally costs more money and will cost more to install. I've searched around a little bit and the only turbo system I could find for the H2 was one in R&D that was selling for $10,500. Generally turbo systems are custom jobs that cost a ton of money. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Could you post a link? The only turbo setups I've seen for the H2 are working TT setups. I'd love to see what a single setup looks like.

You said:<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> If you want to get the best value for horsepower then you can't beat our system. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>I don't think anyone is questioning that. Nor do I think anyone will. But as you can see, there are questions to be asked and answered. I think a huge concern is for the Back Yard mechanic installing it and having a catastrophic failure that's "his fault". One that's hard to prove, but deemed his fault.

Another issue is hitting the trails. There's a lot of components down there with your system that could be damaged. Possible leaving someone on the stranded on the trail.

Next up.... Lag. Or lack of it.

I'm not ignoring your question on the warranty. I wanted to understand the question. After your last post, I was typing up a response when I saw your new reply.

We will warranty your system if you installed it by yourself. Look under the About Us section and there is a link to the STS Limited Parts warranty. Basically we will replace any component of the turbo system that fails. We've rarely denied a warranty claim unless it was totally obvious that it was misused or installed improperly. We are in business and must keep our customers happy if we want to stay in business. You can't make everyone happy, but most people are reasonable.

Kenny did not help with the design of the system. We visited with him on our press tour and after inspecting one of our vehicles he made those comments.

The link I saw was for a TT setup as well. I couldn't find anything for a single.

On the catastrophic failure, you could have that issue if you're installing a supercharger, front mount or turbo system. Forced induction is not for everyone. We've tried to model what the other forced induction companies are doing. We recommend that people go through our dealers for a professional install. I'll make that more prominent on the website.

I believe I have a picture of the H2 turbo system with the H2 on the ground. When I get to work I'll try to find it and post it.

We sponsored this forum to answer people's questions. I'll continue to do my best and if there are issues that the forum members feel need to be resolved, we'll take a look at it and do our best to resolve them.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ARH1956:
Great concept in most applications. I can't imagine you'll find many H2 owners willing to cripple their vehicles off roading abilities with that impossible filter location. The entire system, turbo, filter, tubing, etc., are WAY too vulnerable. This is all that keeps me from buying today. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The air filter can be relocated with a simple hose. The turbo and pipe hang above any of the lowest stock components.

If you are going to be griding your ride on the rocks at Moab then other things are going to get damaged under your vehicle and we agree with you that the system is not the best fit for those people.

Ben

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by H2turbo:
We sponsored this forum to answer people's questions. I'll continue to do my best and if there are issues that the forum members feel need to be resolved, we'll take a look at it and do our best to resolve them. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>That's great and is why I'm asking. These things have been eating at me since I heard about your system. It's great to actually hear from a product manufacturer and thanks for answering the questions posed to you. You'd be surprised how many won't. <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> I wanted to understand the question. After your last post, I was typing up a response when I saw your new reply. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>I understand.<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> We've rarely denied a warranty claim unless it was totally obvious that it was misused or installed improperly. We are in business and must keep our customers happy if we want to stay in business. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>I've been in the hospitality business for years, so I understand what you are saying. But my question was more direct than your answer. How do you diagnose a problem as being the fault of the installer? You claim this turbo system can be installed by mechanically inclined people in "X" amount of time. Do you fly someone to my home to check it out? Do I have to ship my truck to you? With LPE, ( I know, different company, different terms, different price), they came and got my truck, fixed it and returned it. No charge. For 5k+ I wouldn't expect you to do the same, but how do you make the determination?

You also stated:<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> We recommend that people go through our dealers for a professional install. I'll make that more prominent on the website. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Fantastic. I didn't see that anywhere. But does that have an affect on the warranty? I'm feeling I'm not getting solid answers on this which is why I keep going back to it. I'm sure you can straighten this out for me.

Thanks

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by h2turbo:
Here's my view of why someone would choose a remote mount over a traditional turbo system. <span class="ev_code_RED">Novelty? </span>

1. Cost - if a front mount kit is available, it generally costs more money and will cost more to install. I've searched around a little bit and the only turbo system I could find for the H2 was one in R&D that was selling for $10,500. Generally turbo systems are custom jobs that cost a ton of money. <span class="ev_code_RED">Remember the old adage- You get what you pay for. </span>

2. Heat - The other downside of a custom front mount kit is that it is difficult to find a location where the glowing turbo won't melt other components in your engine compartment. When we visited with Kenny Duttweiler he said that many times he's seen people melt the fluid container for the master and get brake fluid everywhere. <span class="ev_code_RED">So you're going to put it out back and relatively unprotected? Bright. </span>

3. Emissions - it is more difficult to pass emissions with the turbos in front of the cats. They take heat away from the cats, so the cats take longer to fire up. <span class="ev_code_RED">Hmmmm... is that why turbo-charged race cars have glowing headers & shoot fire on downshifts? </span>

In terms of performance I don't have any data of our system vs. a front mount.<span class="ev_code_RED">(How convenient) </span> We generally get just as good of gains in horsepower and torque and we get full boost by 3000 rpm. The H2 engine is pumping out a lot of exhaust gases. When you turn a hose on that is full of water, water immediately starts coming out the other end.<span class="ev_code_RED"> That's IF the hose is filled with water. Since you don't sound like you know anything about liquids let me enlighten you with this- liquids can't be compressed. Gases can. Learn it, live it, love it. </span> It is the same with air. <span class="ev_code_RED">No, it's not the same. </span> When we did the calculations it takes about .05 seconds to move enough air to charge the intake pipe on a v8 engine. I'll try to get some of our customers to post on the board. Lag is just not an issue, especially with such a big, heavy vehicle.<span class="ev_code_RED"> I'm calling BS on this. </span> People like to debate this forever and start going back to their physics classes, but the bottom line is that it works. <span class="ev_code_RED">But it's more than likely not the most efficient set up for the H2. </span>

If you've got a ton of money, time and willingness to do a custom setup then you'll be happy with a front mounted system. If you want to get the best value for horsepower then you can't beat our system.<span class="ev_code_RED">Yeah, if you're a chiseler and won't mind an ass end full of extra heat and all of the related problems it will cause components that weren't designed to be exposed to those kinds of temperatures. </span>

Hope that helps! <span class="ev_code_RED">Nope, but it was entertaining. </span>

Ben<span class="ev_code_RED"> Dover</span> </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ben I can understand the need to prioritze. That is not an issue with Me. I own 5 companies and completely understand how a company has to operate to make money. I have 5 that do. That is why I had made the offer to get this done and done almost a year ago maybe, not quite that long. I'm glad to hear this person is gone because I do not call name's but, You are better off without him. The way i explained it to You was exactly how it went down. I bent over backward to try and get this thing done over and over. It was like talking to a wall so i gave up which is something I do not do as a rule.
These Men and Ladies will tell You and some know Me better than others that My word is good as a contract and that I would not distort for all the tea in China.
I had asked STS to provide parts.
Not because i needed financial help I felt that if I was going to be a part of the developement of a H2 STS that STS should at least help.
I appreciate Your apology. I was doing the STS in the very beginning because of the friends I have here that at that time were writing and worried about what it would or what it could not do. I told them then I will get one on and let everyone know how it goes. I took off with excitement with the challenge of just helping My Forum by Me taking the chance on the system without them having to. I saw the potential of the product I will in no way deny that and still do. I think actually if You took a few real H2 owners and I mean the kind that work on them theirselves etc. they could lend some input to perfect. I know You have engineers and can work it out. But, if You do not drive an H2 everyday or off-road You are not going to know the capabilities.
Ben I commend You on staying in there and trying to answer these question. But, again back to prioritizing R@D You would not have to had spent one minute on it just send to us the parts needed to build it. I even had already gotten a guy lined up that was going to tune it so that We would have those number for You to give to Allen Nelson to program PCM's for the system.
If You would PM Me.
I have been offered by a person in Your company to sponsor My next build which will be a lifted H2 that will be show quality camo and blacked out. I at the time thought that I would not even consider the offer but, You being fairly forward about answering questions it is something that i may consider. If You would like to discuss this, PM Me and We can talk.
TAZ

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by h2turbo:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by RLTAZH2:
All i will say about My situation and not mention the dealer as He is a very good man and I do not want to cause Him any problems

But, He and I approached STS to do R@D for H2. I would cover labor and asked STS several times to just furnish the parts. At the end STS would have had a H2 kit last summer.
The reply We got, was not going to do an H2 no market and then another response of not only are We not doing a kit for H2 We will never do one for H2 because there is not enough market there. My response was that Hummer owners spend more money to upgrade everything about their ride than most other vehicles on the road. They have the extra income to do that and that there is a market.

I was told that Your were covered up making
f body kits, did not have time to mess with it. The thing is We did not ask You to mess with it just willing provide the parts and I would cover R@D labor for the dealer. Seemed like a very fair deal to Me. I also offered to promote the turbo once i had it on for a little while to make sure all the bugs were worked out to where it would be a finished product.
So bottom line is I would have been running an STS system for a very long time by now. Instead I had a sponsor for My show H2 that furnished Me with a Magnuson supercharger to be recognised as a sponsor at shows because they saw how aggressive i was at winning whether I had sponsors or just spending My money. I would have had it on when I won the state Hummer title a while back. Not only could I have let the forum members know about it and many would have already been running STS as well but, I could have had every judge at every show looking at the STS system and not counting how many spectators would have been seeing it with a mirror underneath to show it off.

All i can say is it showed a narrow mind or tunnel vision a well as poor ability to judge a market and not taking advice from a person who knew what the market looked like.
That is all i will say as it is water under the bridge and I have moved on.
TAZ </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Taz,

I apologize if that is the way it was communicated to you. The salesperson that covered your area is no longer with the company.

It was not communicated to me in the way you described. We do sell a universal kit and absolutely would have let you take on the project had I known the details.

We always knew there was a market for the H2, but we have limited resources and have to prioritize R&D projects.

Thanks,

Ben </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by KenP:
I've been in the hospitality business for years, so I understand what you are saying. But my question was more direct than your answer. How do you diagnose a problem as being the fault of the installer? You claim this turbo system can be installed by mechanically inclined people in "X" amount of time. Do you fly someone to my home to check it out? Do I have to ship my truck to you? With LPE, ( I know, different company, different terms, different price), they came and got my truck, fixed it and returned it. No charge. For 5k+ I wouldn't expect you to do the same, but how do you make the determination?

I'm feeling I'm not getting solid answers on this which is why I keep going back to it. I'm sure you can straighten this out for me.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Here are the pics that show better where the turbo sits in perspective to the rear end. (you can only attach one pic per message, so the following message will have the second pic)

On the warranty, I now understand what you are asking.

We initially talk with the customer over the phone, if we can't tell what happened we ask them to go to one of our 120 authorized dealers. We've also asked for a digital picture. As a last resort, if they don't live close enough to a dealer, we have them send in the part for inspection and make a determination what happened.

It is hard to prove this to you, but if it is unclear what happened we will error on the side of the customer. Again, this is hard to prove to you, but we've had few warranty claims and it has been fairly obvious to both us and the customer whether it is a bad part or a botched install.

Maybe we are naive, but most of our customers seem to be honest with us about what happens.

Hopefully that provides more clarification for what you were asking.

Ben

Second pic showing the H2 off the lift.

I wonder what the fording depth is with that set up Lame! Hey lets lower our H2's and put funny rice-rocket stickers on them too.

Kinda like "2 Fast 2 Hydrolocked"

Don't forget the neon lights on under carriage but that might pose a clearance problem for that great intake location

Hello H2 Team,
I thought I better get on this discussion about the STS Turbo System since I am the one with the H2 shown above on the Dyno Spec Sheet.

I have to say I really enjoy my H2, before I had the STS installed, it was of course lacking in power and could not pull my race car trailer without a lot of strain. Since the STS system has been installed, towing is much easier and much more enjoyable.

The most fun I have is racing those little rice rocket cars with the big mufflers. They think this big old H2 has no power, but a 6 psi max, the ol'H2 gets out of the way very nice........

I wont set no speed records in the 1/4 mile, but for everyday driving, towing and having fun, this is the way to go.

I was thinking on asking STS if they could turbo a motor-home RV for myself. The job they had done on my H2 was very impressive and boy does it sound good..........

Give me your feed back, thanks for the time.......

Camman

Camman, do something about the underside of your truck. It looks like crap! It appears, by the tires, that your truck is the black one I posted a pic of above. Ben said the step tube supports had to be trimmed. Can you, or Ben post a pic of where and how they were trimmed? I want to see what type of work would be needed to do it and to see what it would do to the rock rail supports.

I think everyone can agree the filter would need to be relocated for any wet wheeling, but I'm curious about the turbo's location in relation to the diff housing. Could you measure it? How much clearance is there between the two? Also, if you don't mind measuring the distance from the ground to the return tube, right where it is next to the driveshaft? These are very important questions that need to be answered for anyone that plans on taking their truck offroad.

Ben, just remember I love turbos, but I have to ask: I could just kiss my drivetrain warranty goodbye with this product, can't I? Or do you have some method of doing it I can't find? Maybe if one of your dealers installs the system the drivetrain would be covered? A big selling point for the Mag SC is the dealer install and being able to retain your warranty. That's why so many go that route and they can be had for a comparative price, plus install.

Again, I guess my biggest concern goes to the warranty issue.

I also would worry about heat transfer to the rear diff. The rear diff is already subjected to extreme heat based on internal friction alone, adding additional heatt from an external source ie." The turbo "would cause the gear oil to break down quicker causing increased wear and just another thought the Eaton locker in the rear diff is solenoid activated and solenoids dont like heat it tends to make them a bit flaky.