Last Sunday's U.S. Grand Prix

[GeorgeSSSS]

I'd like to hear opinions about the debacle last week at Indianapolis. Here's my opinion.

Michelin is to blame for failing to provide proper equipment despite 5 years of engineering experience at the track. FIA handled the situation correctly by not letting Michelin off the hook. If FIA didn't take the position they did, Michelin and every other supplier would be pushing the envelope in coming years and then look to get "taken off the hook" every time they miscalculated. We'd get last minute chicanes (which are dangerous)and/or some cars not racing for points (which isn't fair to fans) and/or who knows what. Although Sunday was a black day for F1, it averted many more black days in the future.

George SSSS

[KenP]

I love to watch NASCAR. My favorite races are the Daytona 500, both Bristol races (Love the night races), both Martinsville, both Richmond and both Talladega (the scariest race of the lot). Favorite driver is Jr. and anyone but J Gordon and Jimmie Johnson.

[PARAGON]

Whew!!!! Hit a dry socket, did I?

[GeorgeSSSS]

I'd like to hear opinions about the debacle last week at Indianapolis. Here's my opinion.

Michelin is to blame for failing to provide proper equipment despite 5 years of engineering experience at the track. FIA handled the situation correctly by not letting Michelin off the hook. If FIA didn't take the position they did, Michelin and every other supplier would be pushing the envelope in coming years and then look to get "taken off the hook" every time they miscalculated. We'd get last minute chicanes (which are dangerous)and/or some cars not racing for points (which isn't fair to fans) and/or who knows what. Although Sunday was a black day for F1, it averted many more black days in the future.

George SSSS

[PARAGON]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by h2co-pilot:
I'm a closet Nascar fan, but I really only like to watch the last 20 laps or so. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Those are nearly identical comments from my wife.

As far as the Hendrick Team comment. That's just because you are a sucker for the drama, huh. Your all fuzzy about the whole team because of last year's tragedy.

[GeorgeSSSS]

Ken was able to respond to HummerNewbie's question faster than I did. Below is some additional background.

Ken's opinion (above) is certainly one shared by very many knowledgable people.

There are ten two-car teams. 7 teams have Michelin tires, 3 have Bridgestone. Michelin's tires couldn't withstand the stress of the last banked turn and Michelin asked to have a chicane added to slow the cars -- -- which would benefit only Michelin. The request was rejected by FIA (race organizers). The Michelin teams then offered to run with a chicane, but not be eligible to score championship points -- which would mean the cars' position on the track (what the fans see) would be meaningless. FIA told them to simply go slower in the last turn which they refused to do. These cars cost about $10 - $14 million each, they have unbelievable telemetry, and could do it IMO.

All 20 cars went around for the parade lap, but rather than proceeding to the starting grid, all 14 Michelin cars pulled into the pits. Only six cars ran the race. A major embarrassment for a world class sport I've been following for more than 40 years. Some people came from as far as South America to see the race. All the fans got ripped off.

Best regards,

George SSSS

[DRTYFN]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ratesguy:
Formula one racing is dead in the U.S. and Sunday was its funeral. Too bad, used to be fun. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Maybe(and that's a big maybe) dead at Indy, but now they'll just work on moving it to VEGAS!!!! I'd love to see it in Vegas. Can you imagine? F1 practice, qualifying and racing during the day, playing around at the casinos and strip clubs at night. Paradise!!

[h2co-pilot]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
Touchy, touchy. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Feely, feely.

[RasterMaster]

Guess I'll have to stick to the dirt tracks!

[GeorgeSSSS]

I began watching F1 in the 1960s. The F1 drivers of that era -- -- Jim Clark, Graham Hill, Jackie Stewart, Jack Brabham, Dennis Hulme, Bruce McLaren (I know I've left out some great ones) -- -- were something special. They drove F1, F2, Indy 500, Le Mans, Can Am, touring sedans, and whatever else came along. Some are dead and some are still with us. They were at all times sportsmen, gentlemen and professionals. They would have never permitted a fiasco as occurred last Sunday.

I do not think we will see their likes again.

George SSSS

[GeorgeSSSS]

F1 is considering having a single tire supplier next season to cut costs (and technology gains) through decreased competition. I doubt F1 is currently favoring Michelin for that slot.

The fact that the teams being sanctioned include all of the mass production car companies (Toyota, Honda, BMW, Mercedes, and Renault) suggests to me that Michelin is banking on either (a) being the tire company for a break away series sponsored by Toyota, Honda, et. al. or (b) being bailed out by those same car companies' political clout within F1.

If F1 focused more on racing and less on politics, they would have the U.S. fan appeal of NASCAR. That won't happen, though, because F1 is above all focused on greed.

George SSSS

[HummerNewbie]

Sorry George, but I have to admit, don't know what happened at the U.S. Grand Prix. What did Michelin do?

[KenP]

Edwards has the pole for Sunday.

The night races are so cool to watch. But any short track is awesome. The F1 crowd doesn't get to see two, three, four or more top notch drivers banging on each other lap after lap to gain just one spot. And paybacks aren't quite the same.

Bristol is really cool because the drivers get their "payback" for some stupid crap they did at a fast track. Nothing like going into a turn with just one guy near you.... except you spun him out a couple of weeks earlier at a Super Speedway. Yep, you're going into the wall Baby. Every car leaves Bristol and Martinsville damaged.

[PARAGON]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by h2co-pilot:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
Your all fuzzy about the whole team because of last year's tragedy. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No, it's because I'm a woman and they are the only team with most of their teeth. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Touchy, touchy.

[DRTYFN]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by KenP:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DRTYFN:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by h2co-pilot:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
Your all fuzzy about the whole team because of last year's tragedy. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No, it's because I'm a woman and they are the only team with most of their teeth. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You mean you don't like guys wiff only 2 or 3 toofuses? Damn, I'm out. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>But guys like the gals with NO teeth! I bet firm crys over this post, too. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

LMAO!!! firm- what a sissy.

[KenP]

Michelin (a French company ) didn't supply the right tire for the speeds in turn three. They lobbied for a chican to slow the cars down. To protest the situation, all but 6 teams parked their cars. Ferrari ran the race, won, and was criticized.

The problem with adding the chican is it's against the rules. The cars are supposed to race on the same track they qualified on. By adding a chican, the track is not the same so they would have to re-qualify. Out of the question.

Here's a comparison made on Wind Tunnel: If One NFL team shows up to a wet, muddy field with the wrong cleats, they don't get to protest the other team and have changes made.

The fans were the losers over the weekend. However, F1 will be the loser over the long term. To pull this just when F1 was trying to make new inroads into the States, stupid.

It's going to get uglier before it gets better.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/C/CAR_F1_MICHELIN?...=2005-06-21-08-42-16

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/C/CAR_F1_FIASCO?SI...=2005-06-20-15-54-43

[Klaus]

IMO, NASCAR has gone down hill in the last 30 years. It used to be that what was raced on Sunday had to be sold on Monday (at least 500 cars). That's why the Hemi engine and the Mopar winged cars were sold to the public in the 60s and 70s.

Hell, now you see front wheel drive cars with 4 cylinder engines raced as V8 rear wheel cars.

[HummerNewbie]

George, Ken and Drty,

Thanks for bringing me up to speed on it. I do love most forms of motor sports but don't get a chance to really follow them that well. I am so glad I am not one of those fans that paid a fortune to go to the race just to have it screwed up by the French

[Christa]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by KenP:
I love to watch NASCAR. My favorite races are the Daytona 500, both Bristol races (Love the night races), both Martinsville, both Richmond and both Talladega (the scariest race of the lot). Favorite driver is Jr. and anyone but J Gordon and Jimmie Johnson. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm not big on F1, I'd have to agree with Ken, I love NASCAR! There is nothing like the sound of a Cup car engine! Nascar Sunday is a religion at our house and is never to be messed with!
I do like Jr alot, but he's having a tough time this year. My husband, son and myself are in a race league with friends and some others and Jimmie has been a big point getter for me. I'm in 5th place against a bunch of guys! Even though there's only 24 in this league I'm still pretty proud of myself We start the 2nd half in a week or two then we start over for points. If you're interested in joining us go to
http://www.greengreengreen.us/ and sign up! It's a $20 buy-in. High score for each week wins $10 and top 3 at the end of half is in the year end money (not sure how much?). It's not alot of dollars, mostly bragging rights, but it's fun!
I love the short tracks and night races also. Lots of wrecks and tempers do flair! I keep crossing my fingers that I'll get to see Busch take one in the nose again!

[DRTYFN]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by h2co-pilot:

I need a beer. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ken, go get the timebomb a beer... please. And give her a rub down with a happy ending, too.