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05-01-2005, 05:21 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2003
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I took the mall queen for its first offroad experience yesterday and had a blast...until about noon. We started out on the trails at 9:00 am and everything was running beautiful. About noon we pulled over for a break, shut it off and got out. 20 minutes later got in, started it, and got chime alarm and looked down...-0- oil pressure. Immediately shut down but the engine had sounded fine with not even lifter noise which proves there was pressure when I shut down earlier. Checked oil, full and clean. Okay, it's that sender or gauge problem and it finally failed, right?. Wrong! Restarted, same thing except now lifter noise starting. No doubt, -0- oil pressure. Now we're in the mountains on the California/Nevada line, no cell or Onstar service. The team did a wonderful job towing me to the closest (30 miles) one bldg "town" where we arrange a flat bed to Vegas. Thanks guys. It's now at the dealer waiting for them to open tomorrow & I lost a nights sleep. I've racked my brain on this and without engine knocking or other sounds I don't think it's bearings or internal engine problem. Oil pumps rarely fail at 16,000 miles and the only thing I can think of that would cause this kind of sudden oil pressure failure is the oil pressure regulator (a ball & spring) within the oil pump. If the spring failed (broke) I believe it would cause -0- psi. For those that understand internal engine workings I'd appreciate your thoughts. HummerTech or anyone else ...you have any ideas?
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Jonahs
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05-02-2005, 02:30 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Dan:
Hmm. Could be a spun bearing too. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>You didn't have to say that Dan 
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Jonahs
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05-04-2005, 11:19 AM
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Hummer Guru
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Dug3x3:
P.S. - Did I win "clogged screen" ? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
No no, my "spun bearing" was the winner!  |
05-02-2005, 05:48 PM
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Paragon...well the bypass valve seems to be okay. They're pulling the oil pan now. This mystery just gets deeper and deeper. I'm going over and inspect when the oil pan is off. Like to see the inside of the engine anyway. It just has to be the pump/regulator or pick up....I think??? Guess I'm just trying to convince myself.
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Jonahs
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05-01-2005, 06:59 PM
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Hummer Expert
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Join Date: Jan 2005
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The obivious answer is the oil pump puked. But i am curious what you find out. Could be clogged screen or plugged passage way etc. Good luck with it.
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05-01-2005, 10:33 PM
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Thanks partsguy. I use a huge auto service chain here in Vegas and have for all my vehicles for 10 years. I really don't think it's the filter. I know they're name brand but just can't remember which one.
The service manual doesn't say anything about the pick up being welded. Of course we both know what that means....nothing. I'm going to personally inspect the problem when they open up the engine.
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Jonahs
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05-01-2005, 10:53 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
I haven't seen the lower of our engines personally but looking at the service manual it looks pretty typical. There is a bolt where the tube goes into the pump (where the o-ring is) but there is also 2 nuts that hold the pick-up tube for support midway of the block. In my thinking those 2 nuts would have to come loose also for it to completely lose pressure, along with the bolt that tightens the end of the tube to the pump. I would think there would still be enough upward pressure from those two support nuts to hold the tube to the pump.
I don't know what to think about the driveway deal though. I look forward to hearing the answer. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Not trying to be funny but maybe it was Friday and they forgot to tighten both the bolts and the nuts? 
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Jonahs
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05-02-2005, 09:25 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">it didn't go from zero to pressure back to zero as you ignorantly state. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Never stated this, sorry. Don't know what to tell you.
As I read LV's statements, I don't think he said this, exactly. I'm I wrong? Would not be the first time.
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05-02-2005, 05:39 PM
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Giggle, giggle. Sorry Jonahs. First comparing a 100HP air cooled engine to the H2 and especially one that is designed to keep pumping oil, even at extreme angles is just funny.
Then to say that the pressure vacillates in stop and go driving and then stay constant at higher speeds....... well..... I guess that's not to be expected.
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05-03-2005, 02:50 AM
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Hummer Authority
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Jonahs it seems if the previous low oil pressure was documented that should give you an out on the turbo. That turbo did not do this. You would have gotten a locked up turbo from no lubrication. if turbo locked up You have a filter that filters the oil before it goes back into engine. This is just not the turbo's fault. Heck it has a stinkin alarm if the oil flow is impeded from the turbo to the engine. The GM warranty guy needs to be taken out and have his head shave at the least if he is not already balded from pulling His hair out.
I have run turbo's in the worst condition around in farming and I cannot count how many turbo's locked up and not trash engine. The same for deep well engines pumping water for 24 hours a day 6 months a year. The turbo's would fail and with the similar filter set up on Your turbo situation the engine would lose power and pour black smoke. Run all night very inefficiantly but, shut them down get a turbo out of the shop pour deisel through it with pan off and flush it over and over. Then change the oil filter on turbo and engine 3 times during the day and run the thing for 5,000 more hours before trouble. Get an attorney familiar with the magneson moss act and try to push it towards arbritation.
I agree with going with a create engine.
sorry to hear this stuff. I fhtere ever was a guy who did not deserve this it is You. let me how it goes.
TAZ
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05 H2 SUV cus. paint, Magnuson SC 6/12lb boost, cowl hood scoop, 12" dash touchscreen, GM elec. fans, HPTuners.com tuning soft., Dynatech headers dual catback exhaust Jet Hot chrome front to back Flowmaster Super 40's, Diamo 8 Karat rims & 325X60-20" Toyo, 4 OEM Captain seats Katzkins leather, rear console computer inside running all AV/NAV etc., Infinity component system 3 amps Tsunami Caps, rear flip down 12" monitor, headrest monitors, overhead console boost, fuel pressure, & A/F ratio gauges
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05-02-2005, 08:07 PM
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Banned
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Hart1:
I disagree with Paragon.
Air cooled or not, the oil pressure must not ever drop to "0" when running. Really a no-brainer...
And this was in fact what was going on with the Pinzgauer. The pump would produce enough pressure at higher speeds/lower gearing to increase oil pressure, while the looseness on the oil pick-up tube was enough to cause a pressure loss when the RPM's were low to medium, so depending on speed or gearing, I got the same readings as you, up and down. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Which one, the pump or the sump? The Pinzauer engine has a dual system the sucks and pumps oil through the engine. Otherwise I am not going to argue this stupidity with you in this thread. Jonahs' pressure dropped to zero once and only once, it didn't go from zero to pressure back to zero as you ignorantly state.
Besides, Pinzgauers don't even have a pressure gauge, something you should know if YOU got the same readings.
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05-03-2005, 01:48 AM
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by KenP:
This just crossed my mind and is a pie-in-the-sky thought, but can you still turn the turbo smoothly by hand? I know you had symptoms before, so like I said, PITS, but you never know. Maybe something went wrong there. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>We're going to check that tomorrow.
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Jonahs
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05-03-2005, 01:29 AM
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Hummer Messiah
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Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Virginia Beach
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
Well, damn. Damn, Damn DAMN. This just sucks!
Is it shavings or more like broken pieces. I mean can it be some broken off part of a valve or something that's in pieces. You might have more justification for making them adhere to the warranty if you can determine that some internal part broke that has nothing to do with the turbo. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>That's what I'm hoping, also. But it needs to be independently examined.
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"My reading of history convinces me that most bad government results from too much government."---Thomas Jefferson
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05-02-2005, 03:28 AM
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Hummer Messiah
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Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Virginia Beach
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LV, be thankful you have a history with this problem. The gearator won't go bad like that unless there was a tremendous amount of play that has gotten worse. It also would have a constant lowering of the OP. Not a sudden drop. You should be able to rule that out.
Is there any way in the world that something made it's way to the oil system during the TC install? During the install of the oil lines?
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"My reading of history convinces me that most bad government results from too much government."---Thomas Jefferson
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05-01-2005, 05:21 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: \"Lost Wages\"
Posts: 1,150
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I took the mall queen for its first offroad experience yesterday and had a blast...until about noon. We started out on the trails at 9:00 am and everything was running beautiful. About noon we pulled over for a break, shut it off and got out. 20 minutes later got in, started it, and got chime alarm and looked down...-0- oil pressure. Immediately shut down but the engine had sounded fine with not even lifter noise which proves there was pressure when I shut down earlier. Checked oil, full and clean. Okay, it's that sender or gauge problem and it finally failed, right?. Wrong! Restarted, same thing except now lifter noise starting. No doubt, -0- oil pressure. Now we're in the mountains on the California/Nevada line, no cell or Onstar service. The team did a wonderful job towing me to the closest (30 miles) one bldg "town" where we arrange a flat bed to Vegas. Thanks guys. It's now at the dealer waiting for them to open tomorrow & I lost a nights sleep. I've racked my brain on this and without engine knocking or other sounds I don't think it's bearings or internal engine problem. Oil pumps rarely fail at 16,000 miles and the only thing I can think of that would cause this kind of sudden oil pressure failure is the oil pressure regulator (a ball & spring) within the oil pump. If the spring failed (broke) I believe it would cause -0- psi. For those that understand internal engine workings I'd appreciate your thoughts. HummerTech or anyone else ...you have any ideas?
__________________
Jonahs
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05-01-2005, 08:14 PM
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Hummer Guru
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Join Date: Nov 2002
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It either failed or the pickup fell off.
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05-03-2005, 04:58 AM
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Hummer Messiah
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LasVegas:
Another strange thing. The oil filter looks clean. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Clean as in no dirty oil, or clean as in no oil period?
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05-02-2005, 09:06 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Palm Desert. CA
Posts: 338
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Besides, Pinzgauers don't even have a pressure gauge, something you should know if YOU got the same readings. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Mine does, as well has most of my Pinz friends. One of the very first upgrades one should get (tack too). "air cooled" no-brainer. Advise: Start thinking out of the box...there is another way....right?
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05-02-2005, 03:30 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
My vote is the right rear axle seal. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Thanks for the humor..I need it.
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Jonahs
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05-01-2005, 09:55 PM
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Banned
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So, since it started knocking we can rule out the sending or gauge. Not being a fan of coincidence, what could have transpired during an oil change that would lead to the regulator failure? I really can't imagine the pickup creating that kind of eratic symptoms, but maybe. I don't guess some contaniment was introduced to the oil during the change that kept "lodging" and impeding oil flow then coming loose and allow pressure to get back up to norm and now finally has stopped flow all together.
Be interesting to know the cause but many times they will just fix it by replacing parts and not seek the cause.
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