New info on the Front Diffs

[HummBebe]

Originally posted by evldave:
chances are if you have access to a welder in the field, you've also got access to someone that can pull half-shafts & DS and you can just drive out in 2WD.

I think you'd have just as much luck with bubble gum vs JB weld on ring gears...

I don't think we can do that on the three's, has something to do with the computer thingy.

[f5fstop]

Originally posted by PARAGON:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HummerNewbie:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
...But there might be a relationship to the two trucks through the front ring/pinions because their build dates are fairly close together...

I agree completely especially since there are now three since HI's has to be replaced. I would really like to see some investigation into this since the three vehicles that I know of with this problem were all purchase right at the same time. Of course any one of them could have been sitting on the lot for a while but I really think this needs to be looked into. Based on VIN numbers I would think it would be fairly easy to check the lot numbers for the gears in each truck. If the lot numbers are all different then that probably counts out a hardening issue but if they are all the same it would narrow down the possible problems in my book. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>I promise, it's being investigated. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh yes, it is being investigated, and maybe some more.

A few notes on other comments.
The axles already come with synthetic fluid, and the fluid is not the problem. The problem appears to be hardness.

Does GM put the minimal parts in the vehicle? Yes and no. The specs on these axles was high, whether or not AAM is cutting corners remains to be seen.

They won't put the largest axle available, for that would be a waste of money, but they won't put the weakest either; especially in something they know will be off-roaded by a certain number at places most would mess their drawers thinking about.

All I can say on this board is that as the numbers of destroyed axles rises, and as of yesterday, there were very very few, people will start asking questions. The three that we have on this board have not hit the warranty reports until the repairs are completed, and the dealer submits the labor op for payment. That is how the warranty numbers are run by engineering.

I can say, that some are raising their eyebrows with just the one photo I sent to engineering and mentioned there were two of these on one day. Tomorrow, I will let them know there are three that I personally know of.

If they jump on this like the cylinder head issue, it will not take many more to explode. The cylinder head issue was researched and the head re-designed with an extremely low number of failures; especially considering the number of these engines are on the road since '04.
I can't say for sure, since I'm low on the totem pole, but I would bet if there is a problem found, there would never be a recall, due to the low numbers of axles that will be replaced. However, I would bet a lunch, that if a problem is found, new axle specs will be established, and these new axles will be put into production, and shipped to service parts, so that the replacement axles, if needed, will be the stronger axle.

That is all I can really say on the matter; except please stop breaking your H3s. For some odd reason, when something big happens on one of these vehicles, I get pushed into the middle to help the situation, and I'm already busier than a one legged man in an ass kicking contest. (I'm trying to be funny... )

[ChasH3]

All I know if there is a problem I rather have it identified and a recall in place, then wait till I get off road somewhere and get stuck....

[HummBebe]

Originally posted by ChasH3:
All I know if there is a problem I rather have it identified and a recall in place, then wait till I get off road somewhere and get stuck....

It will not likely be recalled.....not enough trucks (H3's) that will wheel enough to break it.

[HummBebe]

Oh and PS....

The first Rule of Wheeling, is to never wheel alone.

[ChasH3]

That true too... I'll just have to carry more beer along just in case.

[ChasH3]

But you are right Bebe... I just hope I have the same group of people around to support me like you did if I ever do break down....

[evldave]

Originally posted by HummBebe:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by evldave:
chances are if you have access to a welder in the field, you've also got access to someone that can pull half-shafts & DS and you can just drive out in 2WD.

I think you'd have just as much luck with bubble gum vs JB weld on ring gears...

I don't think we can do that on the three's, has something to do with the computer thingy. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The computer thingy doesn't like bubble gum?

[evldave]

Originally posted by PhilD:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HummBebe:
I don't think we can do that on the three's, has something to do with the computer thingy.

Bet you can, even if you have to start pulling fuses until it works. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Start with the traction control & Stabilitrac and go from there? I've never had electronic anything on my Cherokee or Suburban, but I'd hope you could fool the computer at least enough for 2WD...

[HummBebe]

Originally posted by PhilD:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HummBebe:
I don't think we can do that on the three's, has something to do with the computer thingy.

Bet you can, even if you have to start pulling fuses until it works. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ok, we discussed that on the trail with the HUMMER mechanic.....I called him 2 seconds after I was off the trail....to order parts :-)

He mentioned that Stabilitrac would/could prevent the whole vehicle from operating if disabled.

That was honestly the first thing I thought of, I just wanted to go home

[PARAGON]

Originally posted by HummBebe:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PhilD:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HummBebe:
I don't think we can do that on the three's, has something to do with the computer thingy.

Bet you can, even if you have to start pulling fuses until it works. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ok, we discussed that on the trail with the HUMMER mechanic.....I called him 2 seconds after I was off the trail....to order parts :-)

He mentioned that Stabilitrac would/could prevent the whole vehicle from operating if disabled.

That was honestly the first thing I thought of, I just wanted to go home </div></BLOCKQUOTE>You can simply pull the half shafts and front driveline without pulling any fuses.

All of the traction control, Stabilitrack and ABS runs off of the wheel speed sensors and maybe a sensor at the output shafts of the t-case.

If you are moving the wheels are are all turning and the computer doesn't know if power is going to the front or not.

[HummBebe]

Originally posted by Desert Dan:
HummBebe

I missed the story on how you broke the gears.<span class="ev_code_RED">It's a long one, I went up at a crawl, a set of difficult stairsteps. I crawled up the first and the second no problem, when I tried to get the rear wheels up the third the front ring gear went "Bzzzzzzz" Yes I was in 4 Lo, yes I was locked, yes, I was in first, and yes, I was BTM'ing.</span>

Do you have an auto or 5-speed and do you have 35" tires? <span class="ev_code_RED">Lux / Adventure w/ Auto</span>

KetKat is right about the 4.88's having smaller (more) teeth on the gears. Also with lower gears in the diff and bigger tires the cv joint might start to blow?? <span class="ev_code_RED">Understood, but doesn't the higher ratio give you more low-end torque while crawling???</span>

Also if you change out the front you have to do the rear (not under waranty) too.<span class="ev_code_RED">Correct, whatever you do to the front gear, you have to do to the rear gear as well</span>

Let's just say for arguments sake, the problem is not the ratio, but the material. Why wouldn't I want to go to 4:88's? I think I am going to anyway. Not an expensive upgrade....so what the heck?

And besides, slower is better

[PARAGON]

Originally posted by HummBebe:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Desert Dan:
HummBebe

I missed the story on how you broke the gears.<span class="ev_code_RED">It's a long one, I went up at a crawl, a set of difficult stairsteps. I crawled up the first and the second no problem, when I tried to get the rear wheels up the third the front ring gear went "Bzzzzzzz" Yes I was in 4 Lo, yes I was locked, yes, I was in first, and yes, I was BTM'ing.</span>

Do you have an auto or 5-speed and do you have 35" tires? <span class="ev_code_RED">Lux / Adventure w/ Auto</span>

KetKat is right about the 4.88's having smaller (more) teeth on the gears. Also with lower gears in the diff and bigger tires the cv joint might start to blow?? <span class="ev_code_RED">Understood, but doesn't the higher ratio give you more low-end torque while crawling???</span>

Also if you change out the front you have to do the rear (not under waranty) too.<span class="ev_code_RED">Correct, whatever you do to the front gear, you have to do to the rear gear as well</span>

Let's just say for arguments sake, the problem is not the ratio, but the material. Why wouldn't I want to go to 4:88's? I think I am going to anyway. Not an expensive upgrade....so what the heck?

And besides, slower is better </div></BLOCKQUOTE>What ratio is in there now? I'm sure I could look it up, but I don't remember off the top of my head.

[ChasH3]

Bebe my stabilitrac shut off the other day while I was driving on the Freeway.. I even got a message saying it was off and needed service and the indicator light on the 4x4(All wheel drive) button was off... The H3 drove fine. Then after I got off the freeway and was able to turn the H3 off and back on everything worked fine... Weird.....

[HummBebe]

Originally posted by PARAGON:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HummBebe:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Desert Dan:
HummBebe

I missed the story on how you broke the gears.<span class="ev_code_RED">It's a long one, I went up at a crawl, a set of difficult stairsteps. I crawled up the first and the second no problem, when I tried to get the rear wheels up the third the front ring gear went "Bzzzzzzz" Yes I was in 4 Lo, yes I was locked, yes, I was in first, and yes, I was BTM'ing.</span>

Do you have an auto or 5-speed and do you have 35" tires? <span class="ev_code_RED">Lux / Adventure w/ Auto</span>

KetKat is right about the 4.88's having smaller (more) teeth on the gears. Also with lower gears in the diff and bigger tires the cv joint might start to blow?? <span class="ev_code_RED">Understood, but doesn't the higher ratio give you more low-end torque while crawling???</span>

Also if you change out the front you have to do the rear (not under waranty) too.<span class="ev_code_RED">Correct, whatever you do to the front gear, you have to do to the rear gear as well</span>

Let's just say for arguments sake, the problem is not the ratio, but the material. Why wouldn't I want to go to 4:88's? I think I am going to anyway. Not an expensive upgrade....so what the heck?

And besides, slower is better </div></BLOCKQUOTE>What ratio is in there now? I'm sure I could look it up, but I don't remember off the top of my head. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Adventure has 4:56's

[ChasH3]

Originally posted by ChasH3:
Bebe my stabilitrac shut off the other day while I was driving on the Freeway.. I even got a message saying it was off and needed service and the indicator light on the 4x4(All wheel drive) button was off... The H3 drove fine. Then after I got off the freeway and was able to turn the H3 off and back on everything worked fine... Weird.....

I was just thinking that since the stabilitrac was shut off that maybe there is a way to disconnect it without preventing the whole vehicle from operating and/or disabled like the mechanic stated....

[ketcat]

Again just my opinion......

4.88:1 would give you more torque and get you back to about a stock overall ratio if you have changed out the 285's for 315's. I like the idea of a 4.88 or maybe even a 5.12ish ratio with 315's. On the other hand there is the possibility that a lower ratio (higher numerically) would be easier to break.

In either case I personally would wait and see if more differentials break because it's under warranty now and once you install aftermarket parts the warranty is gone. If it ends up being a bad gear issue and not related to the differential itself then upgrading is probably a safe beat. If on the other hand it's related to the differential I would not want to change anything.