H2 idler and pitman arms replacement

[GasGuzzler]

My right F tire is wearing out on the outside and my local dealer told me I have to replace the idler and pitman arms for about $750 (parts+labor). The mechanic told me (off record) that I should get the Fabtech parts instead since they are much stronger. After checking out the Fabtech site, I discovered that their pitman/idler system is being recalled.

What gives? Should I get the $350 factory parts or should I go with another aftermarket pitman/idler like the Cognito system?

The more research I do, the more confused I get...... Many of the posts here are calling for the Fabtech but what about the recall?

Any advise is appreciated.

[Fastest H-Town Realtor]

MOOG+Front end shop=$250

[tomp]

Go back to stock and add Cognito Pitman and Idler kit to double capture the arms! Trust me on this = big difference in steering!!!!!!!!!!!!

The Moogs are btter than stock but will still wear out. You will still want the Cognito kit and it works with stock or Moog. If you can get Moog cheaper than stock, then go that route and add the Cognito on top of that. Cognito kit comes with both course and fine thread nuts to work with either route you choose.

[GasGuzzler]

If I were to go back to stock, will a kit for a Chevy or GMC 1500 2500 work?

[GasGuzzler]

I just found a MOOG idler and pitman arms set for about $150 shipped. I will also look for the Cognito to go with it. If anyone has more advise, I am all ears.

[tomp]

The Cognito Pitman/Idler kit will make it drive so much better. One of the best things I have ever done to my H2!!!

[GasGuzzler]

Hi Tomp:

So you have this installed in your H2:
http://cognitomotorsports.com/store/page12.html

What about this? Do you have this too?
http://cognitomotorsports.com/store/page11.html


Does my H2 have 1 pitman and 1 idler arms? or do they come in L and R pairs? I am buying them on ebaY so I need to know how many pitman and idler arms I will need.

[tomp]

The H2 has one of each Idler and Pitman.

I have not tried the Idler assembly, but looks like a nice upgrade. However I think the Pitman/Idler kit is a must and will protect the idler arm that you have now or will have after you replace with new.

Replace with Moog and add the Pitman/Idler kit and you will be very happy. I wouldn't add the Idler upgrade kit unless you show Idler wear (which is highly unlikely) after adding the Moogs and Cognito Pitman/Idler kit.

If you have cranked the torsion bars, I would tell you to add the shock extension kit from Cognito. However their shock extensions were made for the 2500HD pickup. Most components on the H2 are the same as the 2500HD except for the shocks. The H2 shocks, including aftermarket shocks, have far less travel in them than the ones on the 2500HD. The H2 shocks have internal and external Bump stops which shortens travel. The Cognito Shock Extension kit raises up the bottom of the shock too high and causes you to ride on bottomed out front shocks that rest on the bump stops (makes for bad ride quality as you trade one evil for another).

I added the Cognito Shock Extensions, but figured out their shortcoming with them being too tall and spent 4 hours cutting them down to 1/2 taller than the stock ones (which is perfect) and rides so much better. Don't buy them unless you are willing to spend a night modifying them to make them work. Cognito is now aware of it as of the first of this week and are expecting an H2 in next week to address the issue I found. Expect them to release shock extensions just for the H2 or for them to stop selling shock extensions for the H2 all together.

[ROX]

The Cognito Pitman/Idler kit will make it drive so much better. One of the best things I have ever done to my H2!!!I'm installing mine in the morning. I just got my Cognito Steering Support kit a couple of days ago. I didn't order the Idler Arm Pivot, but that might be next.

I'm glad to hear good reviews on it.

GG, bottom line is that all the idler arms will wear out over time. If you got good mileage out of your first set, chances are a stock set will serve you fine.

You only need one each. It probably would be best to have the tire shop replace these for you, since you'll need an alignment afterward. They can confirm what the dealer told you and order the parts.

[dochummer]

Hey Rox, is your current rig the one you were having all the problems with....in regards to the steering?

[ROX]

Hey Rox, is your current rig the one you were having all the problems with....in regards to the steering?Yes. I replaced the idler arm in Nov after the rubicon, then ran 5000 freeway miles, no offroad stuff, and had them replaced again 2 weeks ago. I had the torsion bars replaced along with the ripped idler/pitman arms, the Steering gears and one of the axel seals was leaking again. I'm sick of this car. I wasn't even pulling the trailer for those miles. :rant:

But! I'm still going to Moab!:dancingbanana:

[dochummer]

Yes. I replaced the idler arm in Nov after the rubicon, then ran 5000 freeway miles, no offroad stuff, and had them replaced again 2 weeks ago. I had the torsion bars replaced along with the ripped idler/pitman arms, the Steering gears and one of the axel seals was leaking again. I'm sick of this car. I wasn't even pulling the trailer for those miles. :rant:

But! I'm still going to Moab!:dancingbanana:

Dang, and I'm frettin' about a small front diff leak.... :o

[dochummer]

Anybody have the part number for the stock idler arm and pitman? I found an old post with the pitman, but the idler number didn't work on gmpartsdirect.com -

From GMPartsDirect:

Idler Arm Kit:

GM PART # 12471383 *
CATEGORY: All
PACK QTY: 1 CORE CHARGE: $0.00
GM LIST: $162.63
OUR PRICE: $92.70
DESCRIPTION: ARM KIT


Pitman Arm Kit:

GM PART # 12479051
CATEGORY: All
PACK QTY: 1 CORE CHARGE: $0.00
GM LIST: $111.07
OUR PRICE: $63.31
DESCRIPTION: ARM KIT

I think my current pitman and idler are find, so I may order the cognito's with the coarse threads....just want to check the price if I ever have to replace the stock pitman/idler...

[GasGuzzler]

Finally got my Idler and Pitman arms replaced and the cognito brackets installed. Here's what I paid (approximate prices including tax):

$140 Idler and Pitman arms from Pepboys
$240 Cognito kit from Nor-Cal Trucks in Livermore, CA
$170 Installation by a neighborhood mechanic
------
$550 sub total

$100 alignment
------
$650 Grand Total

I think I did OK considering the H2 dealership wants $800 for the job minus the Cognito kit. My steering now feels precise and quiet -- NIIICE.

[ROX]

Mine is better too. I hope it stays that way. I'll give it a good workout when I leave for Arizona in a couple of weeks.

[Tah2oe]

Dude, where in Pleasanton did you have the work done. I need to have the same thing done before Moab. Let me know if you don't mind.

[dochummer]

I'm still trying to decide if I'm going to wait until the stock pitman/idler wear out before I get the cognito and new arms, or just throw the cognito on.... :(
I've got 54k miles on it, and so far they seem to be ok...

[GasGuzzler]

My mechanic is in Milpitas, CA. His shop is called Fil-AM. Owner and head mechanic is Clifford. I have been using him for the last 15 years for different things. He is pretty good. I think his address is 135 Minnis Circle.

Best, John

[lasvegash2]

what are indications that these parts are going bad. i have the fabtech lift and tie rod ends along with 38.5" tires. i have about 15k miles on them right now.

[dochummer]

Finally got my Idler and Pitman arms replaced and the cognito brackets installed. Here's what I paid (approximate prices including tax):

$140 Idler and Pitman arms from Pepboys
$240 Cognito kit from Nor-Cal Trucks in Livermore, CA
$170 Installation by a neighborhood mechanic
------
$550 sub total

$100 alignment
------
$650 Grand Total

I think I did OK considering the H2 dealership wants $800 for the job minus the Cognito kit. My steering now feels precise and quiet -- NIIICE.

That's a great price on the Pitman/Idler arms. Did they price match or was that what they were selling at? I just found them online at rockauto.com for $144.81 shipped (Moog K6535/K6654). Perfection tire quoted me $324 just for the parts... :)

[GasGuzzler]

Pepboys did not match price for my purchase. I forget which is which but one was about 50 and change + tax and the other was about 80 +tax. They both were made by McQuay-Norris.

www.partsamerica.com (http://www.partsamerica.com) sells them for a little more $160 for both shipped. They also sell MOOG for about $200 for both. Notice the McQuay-Norris has the lifetime warranty and MOOG has only a 1-yr warranty.

ebaY also sells them cheap. Check out Item numbers: 220089269262; 110094374104;

For a $23 idler arm, try item 230092917692 - WOW!

Best, GasGuzzler.

[GasGuzzler]

what are indications that these parts are going bad. i have the fabtech lift and tie rod ends along with 38.5" tires. i have about 15k miles on them right now.

When your wheels are off the ground, grab a front wheel with both hands. Try to rock that wheel left and right and see if there is a bit of play. If this play is excessive, thats when the steering gets sloppy and your alignment will suffer thus your tires will wear out prematurely.

Try the Cognito site for more info:
http://cognitomotorsports.com/store/page18.html

I have the Cognito brackets and they are nice.

Best, GasGuzzler.

[walc]

I just bought the Cognito Pitman/Idler kit, from Trail Duty, and had it installed today.
Installation took my non-dealer shop about an hour. Tech said I shouldn't need alignment, as I only have 1750 miles and no problems, before installation of the kit.
Steering seems tighter and more responsive.

[dochummer]

Has anybody heard of this brand;

Chassis 500 made by Coni-Seal, N.J. USA.

Ebay has idler and pitman arms together for 60 bucks shipped with 15 month warranties....I'm assuming the fine thread cognitos would fit these?

[mwrbunny]

is premature wear a problem for stock vehicle/stock tire size?......(or primarily due to running larger tires?)

[GasGuzzler]

Hey Doc,

Nope, they are not matched. These are prices from their computer database. Also, you may want to check ebaY. They have the MOOG units from even less. --THX, Guzzler

That's a great price on the Pitman/Idler arms. Did they price match or was that what they were selling at? I just found them online at rockauto.com for $144.81 shipped (Moog K6535/K6654). Perfection tire quoted me $324 just for the parts... :)

[GasGuzzler]

1. If you have (it is being called different terms on this forum) --
a. Sloppy steering or
b. Steering wanders or
c. Steering drfts
2. With the front wheel(s) off the ground, grab a wheel using both hands by the west and east sides. Rock your wheel and get a feel on how much play it has. I forget what the dealers mechanic said, but I think the free play should be less than 0.5 inch from end to end.

3. Abnormal tire wear and an alignment cannot help.

This is NOT a H2 only problem. This apprently is a GM truck steering problem. See the below Google search:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=pitman+idler+gm+trucks&btnG=Google+Search

what are indications that these parts are going bad. i have the fabtech lift and tie rod ends along with 38.5" tires. i have about 15k miles on them right now.

[GasGuzzler]

I don't think larger tires will result in premature wear. They will change your odometer readout though. You should rotate your wheels with oil changes and check your alignment on a regular basis to prevent abnormal tire wear.

is premature wear a problem for stock vehicle/stock tire size?......(or primarily due to running larger tires?)

[GasGuzzler]

I would call Cognito to verify.

Has anybody heard of this brand;

Chassis 500 made by Coni-Seal, N.J. USA.

Ebay has idler and pitman arms together for 60 bucks shipped with 15 month warranties....I'm assuming the fine thread cognitos would fit these?

[JoeHummer]

So I just rolled over 32,000 miles on my 2005. How can I get the Pitman and idlers stuff covered by warrantee before it goes out? How hard is it to install the Cognit kit? Thanks.

[GasGuzzler]

These arms are part of the wear and tear. In my opinion, it would be tough to get them to pay for it. They are probably still good after only 32K miles. I think adding the Cognito kit will prolong their life.

Adding the Cognito kit is pretty easy. Probably an hour of your time and a bit of elbow grease. Call Cognito and they will guide you through.

There's an article posted here from offroad.com:
http://www.*******club.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2967

Hope this helps.

So I just rolled over 32,000 miles on my 2005. How can I get the Pitman and idlers stuff covered by warrantee before it goes out? How hard is it to install the Cognit kit? Thanks.

[ROX]

These arms are part of the wear and tear. In my opinion, it would be tough to get them to pay for it. They are probably still good after only 32K miles. I think adding the Cognito kit will prolong their life.
My dealership replaces the steering gear under warranty, and extended warranty every time, FWIW. Adding this kit is supposed to revive old parts and make new ones last forever... Here's an article I found.
I've had these parts installed for a week and so far it feels really tight. I'm excited to see how much it really works after a few thousand miles and towing a small trailer.

Fix the sloppy steering in your Late Model Chevy - Cognito Motorsports Pitman (http://chevy.off-road.com/chevy/article/articleDetail.jsp?id=200035)



Sep 1, 2005 By: Dean Waters (http://chevy.off-road.com/chevy/author/authorInfo.jsp?id=24047) Chevy at Off-Road.com

If you are the owner of a late model Chevy you have probably either heard of or experienced a problem with sloppy steering on your chevy or GMC. This becomes especially apparent if you install a lift and larger tires, or simply turn up the torsion bars on your vehicle.The solution has generally been a new pitman arm and new idler arm. These parts will set you back a couple hundred bucks plus labor. You can almost be assured that you will be replacing steering components every 5000 miles or less on a lifted truck if you don't do something to fix the problem. Even a stock truck will most likely start experiencing problems around 30,000 miles, or even much less if the torsion bars are turned up. This is a big problem with the H2 Hummer as well since it has all wheel drive and 35" tall tires from the factory.
You can find out if you have a problem fairly easily. Using a floor jack, place it under one of the lower control arms close to the inside of the front tire. Jack up the vehicle under the lower control arm until the tire next to the jack is just off of the ground. Now, grab the wheel that is off of the ground and turn it back and forth like you are trying to steer it. Pay attention to the centerlink and the pitman and idler arms and you can actually see all of the play in the steering system. Take note of how much you are able to turn the tire back and forth, and then after you realize that the other front tire is still on the ground and not moving, it should occur to you there is something not right. With this problem, no good allignmnet shop will be able to allign the front end and keep a consistant toe setting. This will cause irregular tire wear and can also cause tie rod problems
This problem is present in the older Ford F-150 as well that used a pitman and idler arm. It occurs becuse the joint in the pitman and idler arms where the center link attaches is not sufficient the way it is designed. And again this problem is accelerated by any type of lift and larger tires. New parts will only solve the problem temporarily. You can even replace the parts with heavy duty Moog components from their "Problem Solver" line of parts. This will probably solve the problem for some time on a stock truck but we have heard that even these components wear quickly on a lifted truck. Even the new Fabtech Pitman and Idler arm kit, which is almost twice the size of stock does not solve this problem.
To the Rescue
To the rescue comes Cognito Motorsports. Being a diehard GM fan and a degreed Mechanical Engineer from California Polytechnic State University of San Luis Obispo, Cognito Motorsports owner Justin Lambert began working on a solution to this steering problem. After looking at numerous solutions and trying several designs Justin has arrived with a bolt-on solution to the idler arm / pitman arm problem. In most cases you do not even need to replace the currently worn parts. If you have extreme wear you may want to replace the components but at least you can be assured that this will be the LAST time.
http://chevy.off-road.com/chevy/data/articlestandard/chevy/472005/200035/cognito_008.jpg (http://chevy.off-road.com/chevy/data/articlestandard/chevy/472005/200035/cognito_008.jpg)Cognito Motorsports Idler / Pitman support Kit. Yea, I know, the pictures suck!We had recently purchased a 2002 2500HD truck with around 30,000 miles on it. We were investigating different leveling kits when we discovered the Cognito Idler Arm / Pitman Arm support kit. Our truck was relatively new and had stock tires and wheels on it and we did not really feel a steering problem. But we decided to perform the simple check just for the heck of it. To our amazement there was a huge amount of slop on both sides. We doubt this truck had even seen any miles off the pavement yet it was in need of a new pitman arm and idler arm.
We located a Cognito dealer, Gresham 4WD in Gresham, Oregon, and made an appointment to get the Cognito kit installed. By the way, we also had them install a Cognito Leveling kit which we will review next month. Note: If you already have an aftermarket idler arm / pitman arm like the Moog kit you will need a different part #. The stock components use a course thread vs a fine thread on the aftermarket pieces
http://chevy.off-road.com/chevy/data/articlestandard/chevy/472005/200035/cognito_027.jpg (http://chevy.off-road.com/chevy/data/articlestandard/chevy/472005/200035/cognito_027.jpg)http://chevy.off-road.com/chevy/data/articlestandard/chevy/472005/200035/cognito_044.jpg (http://chevy.off-road.com/chevy/data/articlestandard/chevy/472005/200035/cognito_044.jpg)You will need to remove this plastic cover to get access to the steering components.Removing the idler arm bolts will make the installation go easier. This is not necessary if you have the sway-bar removed.
http://chevy.off-road.com/chevy/data/articlestandard/chevy/472005/200035/cognito_039.jpg (http://chevy.off-road.com/chevy/data/articlestandard/chevy/472005/200035/cognito_039.jpg)http://chevy.off-road.com/chevy/data/articlestandard/chevy/472005/200035/cognito_042.jpg (http://chevy.off-road.com/chevy/data/articlestandard/chevy/472005/200035/cognito_042.jpg)This is the support kit installed on the idler arm. The idler arm stud is now double captured around the center link.This is the support kit installed on the pitman arm. It also adds an additional attachment point to the center link.Summary
The installation of the new Cognito Motorsports support kit was installed very quickly by the experts at Gresham 4WD. Don, owner of Gresham 4WD, recommends that one be installed with every lift kit. No matter which brand you choose. The kit could be installed at home but a lift and air tools sure make it easier.
The support kit is a relatively simple solution to a very serious problem for late model GM owners. For around $200 plus instalation I am not sure how any GM owner can afford to NOT install this kit. Give Justin or Don a call, their contact information is below, and get one on the way.
Next month we install the Cognito Leveling kit on our 2500HD.

[tbuckley]

Fortunate for me I live near Gresham, OR -- I just dropped off my rig to have the idler/pitman replaced along with a new idler pivot at this off road center. I'm running 38.50" Toyos and the steering is getting sloppy on less than 10,000 miles. Cognito should fix me up!

[HumminNBoatin']

uhhh this thread is 3 1/2 years old! lol

[Xotik H3]

I suppose better late than never? :twak: