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Aubs
11-09-2005, 09:18 PM
I hope no one else has as thread too similar to this one. Anyway, check out the Autospies.com pics of the new FJ Cruiser, inside and out. If this is at all similar to the production model, there's no way I can see it being an H3 competitor. It's small and completely cheap looking inside (even with upgraded materials-- and we're talking about this being a SHOW car here-- I still can't see it). It looks neat, but that's debatable too. Well, love to hear what you guys think, those that do read this section of the forums.

Autospies.com FJ Cruiser Interior Photos (http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp?articleId=5799)

Autospies.com FJ Cruiser Exterior Photos (http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp?articleId=5798)

KenP
11-09-2005, 10:06 PM
Ugly, lots of overhang, huge blindspot...

DDWH
11-09-2005, 10:27 PM
Yeah that things a let down. Looks like a puffed up touregg! I had always hoped they would have done a full on retro LC 4 door with a v8 and all the modern day comforts.

DTHVLY
11-09-2005, 10:29 PM
Rubber floors instead of carpet, water resistant seats, locking rear diff, traction control, 115 volt AC outlet, rock sliders, heavy duty roofrack with aux lighting, dash mounted GPS, compass, inclinometer, and temp, all standard or factory options, sounds pretty functional to me, not cheap. As far as build quality Toyota's got the best in the industry.

The FJ Cruiser's got a shorter wheel base, more ground clerance, more horse power, and way more torque than the H3, plus it weighs less and can tow more. Sounds like it could be threat to the H3, what do you think?

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/FJspecs.jpg

DDWH
11-09-2005, 10:45 PM
YAWN!!!http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

It's GHEY as a touregg ya troll!

DTHVLY
11-09-2005, 10:58 PM
Originally posted by DDWH:
YAWN!!!http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

It's GHEY as a touregg ya troll!

I guess looks are a matter of opinion, but the numbers don't lie. and as far as me being a troll I've been on this board for over two years and you've been here one month.

If I'm a troll then your a "Post Whore".

Aubs
11-10-2005, 12:48 AM
Originally posted by DTHVLY:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DDWH:
YAWN!!!http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

It's GHEY as a touregg ya troll!

I guess looks are a matter of opinion, but the numbers don't lie. and as far as me being a troll I've been on this board for over two years and you've been here one month.

If I'm a troll then your a "Post Whore". </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Ok, play nice guys. I'd say it's not a threat because I believe that if you're looking for a HUMMER, then you expect true luxury combined with functionality. As for this thing, it looks like you could seat two at best, unless you are friends with Hobbits. The wash out floors are nice, but just get rubber mudder floor mats and then shake/wash them out when they get dirty. Would you want to have to wash all the muck out instead, because I bet floormats aren't included? Me, I want the soft and plush leather seats and I'll just put the water proof covers on them when I do want to get dirty. Also, that blindspot is HUGE! Just look at the pictures. It has to be hard to see anything but out the front. And as for side impact safety, I haven't seen split/suicide doors do any better than poor (ala Honda Element). Otherwise, I do like the lights on the side mirrors, and the idea of dash mounted inclinonmeter and GPS. But honestly, the inclinometer and GPS are very easy to get aftermarket and some systems are excellent compared to factory stuff. But I wouldn't trade the refinement of the H3 interior for the FJ. I had a '99 Land Cruiser for a year, and it was nice, but compared to the Hummers we drive today, it was a POS!

That's just my humble opinion.

DTHVLY
11-10-2005, 09:56 PM
I'd say it's not a threat because I believe that if you're looking for a HUMMER, then you expect true luxury...Me, I want the soft and plush leather seats...I wouldn't trade the refinement of the H3 interior for the FJ.

That's just my humble opinion.

I agree with you, if a luxury grocery getter SUV with carpet, "soft plush leather seats" and push button 4wd is what you want then the H3, VW Toureg, or Lexus are a good choice, but if you want an out of the box offroad vehicle that's got more ground clerance, more power, more torque, less weight, more towing capacity, and more functional options, then the FJ would be your choice.

If your willing to trade horse power and offroad ability for "soft plush leather seats" then go with the H3. there's nothing wrong with Luxury SUV's it just depends on what you want.

RazM
11-11-2005, 09:07 AM
Originally posted by DTHVLY:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I'd say it's not a threat because I believe that if you're looking for a HUMMER, then you expect true luxury...Me, I want the soft and plush leather seats...I wouldn't trade the refinement of the H3 interior for the FJ.

That's just my humble opinion.

I agree with you, if a luxury grocery getter SUV with carpet, "soft plush leather seats" and push button 4wd is what you want then the H3, VW Toureg, or Lexus are a good choice, but if you want an out of the box offroad vehicle that's got more ground clerance, more power, more torque, less weight, more towing capacity, and more functional options, then the FJ would be your choice.

If your willing to trade horse power and offroad ability for "soft plush leather seats" then go with the H3. there's nothing wrong with Luxury SUV's it just depends on what you want. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Dude, you like the FJ, we're all very happy for you. To come in to a forum JUST to knock a vehicle with pure grade A Bullsh*t takes a special type of person. A person who must have endless amounts of time on their hands. A person who feels so low about themselves that they feel better bothering others.

If you can't stop trolling, atleast become a CREATIVE troll, one who gives much more amusement to the forum members. Remember, if you wanna be a clown, atleast put your makeup on, otherwise you just aren't trying.

BTW, what's the approach and departure angle on that thing? How about breakover?

Thanks for trying.

PARAGON
11-11-2005, 02:41 PM
Originally posted by DTHVLY:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I'd say it's not a threat because I believe that if you're looking for a HUMMER, then you expect true luxury...Me, I want the soft and plush leather seats...I wouldn't trade the refinement of the H3 interior for the FJ.

That's just my humble opinion.

I agree with you, if a luxury grocery getter SUV with carpet, "soft plush leather seats" and push button 4wd is what you want then the H3, VW Toureg, or Lexus are a good choice, but if you want an out of the box offroad vehicle that's got more ground clerance, more power, more torque, less weight, more towing capacity, and more functional options, then the FJ would be your choice.

If your willing to trade horse power and offroad ability for "soft plush leather seats" then go with the H3. there's nothing wrong with Luxury SUV's it just depends on what you want. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Dude, you need to pull back and rethink your position. The POS FJ doesn't even have a rear locker as standard, it's an option. It's got 19 more horsepower, wow that's a clear cut winner. We don't know about it's crawl ratio, do we? It has 1/2" more ground clearance, yep that makes a difference. There is a 2wd only version, that makes it a real contender. It is a 2 door, yet still doesn't have the off-road specs to compete with a 4 door H3.

So according to your stupidity, 19HP and 1/2" in ground clearance makes it a "trade for horse power and offroad ability" to choose the H3. Is your name Chris?

RazM
11-12-2005, 08:59 AM
Originally posted by PARAGON:
Is your name Chris?

http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I get that one http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Adventurer
11-22-2005, 04:41 PM
I'm guessing that the FJ is designed mostly for a youthful audience, and will therefore not have the luxury of a Hummer. As for off-road prowess compared to an H3, too soon to tell.

DTHVLY
11-23-2005, 10:36 PM
Originally posted by RazM:
Dude, you like the FJ, we're all very happy for you. To come in to a forum JUST to knock a vehicle with pure grade A Bullsh*t takes a special type of person. A person who must have endless amounts of time on their hands. A person who feels so low about themselves that they feel better bothering others.

If you can't stop trolling, atleast become a CREATIVE troll, one who gives much more amusement to the forum members. Remember, if you wanna be a clown, atleast put your makeup on, otherwise you just aren't trying.

BTW, what's the approach and departure angle on that thing? How about breakover?

Thanks for trying.

I didn’t just come into this forum to knock your beloved H3, DUDE. I have been on this forum for over 2 years and have been thinking about getting an H3 since before it even came out, but now that the FJ is coming out I’m going to consider it too. Obviously I’m not completely obsessed with the H3 like you are, I like to actually consider other vehicles before dropping $30K on one. If I can get equal or better off-road ability in a more reliable vehicle for around the same price then I'm going to do it. You remind me of those diehard Mustang guys back in the 90’s who always got there asses smoked by the Z28 and Corvette guys but they would still claim that their Rustang’s were better.

I replied to an FJ thread in the "Other Offroad Vehicles" section of this forum with facts about the FJ and now I'm a troll? Give me a break DUDE. Now if I would have started a thread entitled “Why the FJ is the greatest SUV to hit the trails and why the H3 is a POS” in the "H3 Discussion" folder then that would be a diffrent story. I like how you label anyone who has anything positive to say about any other vehicle besides a Hummer as a troll. The term "troll" has become so cliché on this forum it’s not even funny anymore.

I guess I understand your hostility and aggression I would be pissed too if I had been totally ostersized by the off-road community as well as targeted by enviro-nazis. That's something to be considered before buying a Hummer. I don't really want to take the chance of getting stuck out in the middle of no where and having some Jeep or Toyota guy driving by and laughing instead of helping, or having to worry about eco-terrorist vandalizing my vehicle every time I drive into the city.

BTW, A vehicle with a shorter wheel base and more ground clearance (the FJ), will have a better break over angle than a vehicle with a longer wheel base and less ground clearance (the H3).

Thanks for trying DUDE…


Oh yeah, and the Maple Leafs suck!

DTHVLY
11-23-2005, 10:59 PM
Originally posted by sfox:

So just a question, we have seen what an H3 can do off road, have you seen one of these new "UGLY AS SH1T" FJ's off road yet? Or is your concept of an off-road vehicle what you've seen in Xterra commercials? Seriously, the approach and departure angles are just terrible and the breakover isn't any better than any other grocery getter available. From the few glam shots on Toyotas website, the flex on the rear is worse than an H1, and that's really bad for a solid rear axle vehicle.

S

Actually I have seen the FJ off-road. They had the video of it running the Rubicon with no problems at SEMA. As far as you thinking it’s ugly, I think we already covered that argument earlier in the thread. I’ll admit the H3 has slightly better A/D angles but I wouldn’t consider 33.5 and 30 to be terrible and the FJ does have a better break over angle, a shorter wheel base, and more ground clearance than the H3, so you do the math.

Originally posted by sfox:
the breakover isn't any better than any other grocery getter available...

Well it's better than the H3's breakover so according to you the H3 is just another grocery getter.

You said it.

DennisAJC
11-24-2005, 10:29 AM
FJ made it's debut here in Japan last year (The original here in Japan was called the Land Cruiser but this new model is called "Fun Cruiser" http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif.

It's considered a novelty but not respected as an off road vehicle like the 4Runner or Surf (It's priced here with the Rav 4, it's considered equal). It's all look and will fall apart against the first curb it hits.

The reaction was so terrible here, they're not considering even selling them here http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif. But the Japanese are betting a bunch of suckers in the US and Canada will gobble it up.

Even most Japanese I talk to know and revere the H1, H2, and now hot item H3. The sentiment is everything else is benchmarked against the Hummer Brand.

FJ is a threat....NOT

And don't joke about that crap against Hummers. It's not even funny.

Good Luck! http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

RazM
11-27-2005, 03:47 PM
Originally posted by DTHVLY:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by RazM:
Dude, you like the FJ, we're all very happy for you. To come in to a forum JUST to knock a vehicle with pure grade A Bullsh*t takes a special type of person. A person who must have endless amounts of time on their hands. A person who feels so low about themselves that they feel better bothering others.

If you can't stop trolling, atleast become a CREATIVE troll, one who gives much more amusement to the forum members. Remember, if you wanna be a clown, atleast put your makeup on, otherwise you just aren't trying.

BTW, what's the approach and departure angle on that thing? How about breakover?

Thanks for trying.

I didn’t just come into this forum to knock your beloved H3, DUDE. I have been on this forum for over 2 years and have been thinking about getting an H3 since before it even came out, but now that the FJ is coming out I’m going to consider it too. Obviously I’m not completely obsessed with the H3 like you are, I like to actually consider other vehicles before dropping $30K on one. If I can get equal or better off-road ability in a more reliable vehicle for around the same price then I'm going to do it. You remind me of those diehard Mustang guys back in the 90’s who always got there asses smoked by the Z28 and Corvette guys but they would still claim that their Rustang’s were better.

I replied to an FJ thread in the "Other Offroad Vehicles" section of this forum with facts about the FJ and now I'm a troll? Give me a break DUDE. Now if I would have started a thread entitled “Why the FJ is the greatest SUV to hit the trails and why the H3 is a POS” in the "H3 Discussion" folder then that would be a diffrent story. I like how you label anyone who has anything positive to say about any other vehicle besides a Hummer as a troll. The term "troll" has become so cliché on this forum it’s not even funny anymore.

I guess I understand your hostility and aggression I would be pissed too if I had been totally ostersized by the off-road community as well as targeted by enviro-nazis. That's something to be considered before buying a Hummer. I don't really want to take the chance of getting stuck out in the middle of no where and having some Jeep or Toyota guy driving by and laughing instead of helping, or having to worry about eco-terrorist vandalizing my vehicle every time I drive into the city.

BTW, A vehicle with a shorter wheel base and more ground clearance (the FJ), will have a better break over angle than a vehicle with a longer wheel base and less ground clearance (the H3).

Thanks for trying DUDE…


Oh yeah, and the Maple Leafs suck! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh for crying out loud, that's it you're a nutjob.

Go re-read some of your other posts, where you constantly knock the H3 is your oh-so-sly ways.

Get a life man, go to an FJ forum and give them a BJ.

DTHVLY
11-29-2005, 10:56 PM
Originally posted by PARAGON:
The POS FJ doesn't even have a rear locker as standard, it's an option.
So having an optional rear locker makes the FJ POS, OK? I would be willing to bet that 90% of Hummer owners not only don’t use the locker but they don’t even know what it does. The only way having an optional rear locker is a problem is if you can’t afford it, I don’t have that problem.

It's got 19 more horsepower, wow that's a clear cut winner.
So you think 19 more horsepower and 73 more pound feet of torque in a vehicle that weighs nearly 1000 lbs. less isn’t a lot? I guess if that makes you feel better then go ahead and keep thinking that, but the fact is that the H3 is even more underpowered than the H2 and it has one of the worst power to weight ratios of any SUV out there.

It has 1/2" more ground clearance, yep that makes a difference.
Actually the FJ has over an inch more ground clearance than the H3, 1.3” to be exact. The FJ has 9.8” and the H3 has 8.5”, comparing both vehicles with the standard 32” tires. If you want to compare both with the optional 33” tires the FJ has 10.4” and the H3 has 9.1”. Now an extra inch of clearance may not make a difference when your cruising the street all day but when your off-road and there’s an extra inch between your undercarriage and the rocks it’s a lot and yes it does make a difference.

There is a 2wd only version, that makes it a real contender.
Again not a problem unless you can’t afford the 4wd.

It is a 2 door, yet still doesn't have the off-road specs to compete with a 4 door H3.
I guess your just pulling this out of your ass because the FJ beats the H3 in every off-road spec. except A/D angles. The FJ has more ground clearance, a shorter wheel base, a better break over angle, it weighs less, it has more power, and it has better off-road options, plus it has a real transfer case shifter instead of pushbutton like the H3. Push button 4wd is the gayest thing in the world.

Dude, you need to pull back and rethink your position.
No, I think it's you that needs to pull back and rethink your position.

Is your name Chris?
No, the name is Richard but it’s Dick to you...

PARAGON
11-30-2005, 08:24 PM
Originally posted by DTHVLY:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
The POS FJ doesn't even have a rear locker as standard, it's an option.
So having an optional rear locker makes the FJ POS, OK? I would be willing to bet that 90% of Hummer owners not only don’t use the locker but they don’t even know what it does. The only way having an optional rear locker is a problem is if you can’t afford it, I don’t have that problem.<span class="ev_code_RED">I said it was a POS AND it didn't have it standard. I didn't say it was because. Try reading comprehension next year. Who cares what owners use/don't use, know/don't know. We were discussing a POS FJ on Hummer forum here weren't we?</span>

It's got 19 more horsepower, wow that's a clear cut winner.
So you think 19 more horsepower and 73 more pound feet of torque in a vehicle that weighs nearly 1000 lbs. less isn’t a lot? I guess if that makes you feel better then go ahead and keep thinking that, but the fact is that the H3 is even more underpowered than the H2 and it has one of the worst power to weight ratios of any SUV out there.<span class="ev_code_RED">People that use their rigs are more worried about crawl ratios, not HP to weight.</span>

It has 1/2" more ground clearance, yep that makes a difference.
Actually the FJ has over an inch more ground clearance than the H3, 1.3” to be exact. The FJ has 9.8” and the H3 has 8.5”, comparing both vehicles with the standard 32” tires. If you want to compare both with the optional 33” tires the FJ has 10.4” and the H3 has 9.1”. Now an extra inch of clearance may not make a difference when your cruising the street all day but when your off-road and there’s an extra inch between your undercarriage and the rocks it’s a lot and yes it does make a difference.<span class="ev_code_RED">Just shut up, already. Go get some updated specs.</span>

There is a 2wd only version, that makes it a real contender.
Again not a problem unless you can’t afford the 4wd.<span class="ev_code_RED">Actually, it is a problem. It means it's not purpose built. Of course, you would have to drive to understand that.</span>

It is a 2 door, yet still doesn't have the off-road specs to compete with a 4 door H3.
I guess your just pulling this out of your ass because the FJ beats the H3 in every off-road spec. except A/D angles. The FJ has more ground clearance, a shorter wheel base, a better break over angle, it weighs less, it has more power, and it has better off-road options, plus it has a real transfer case shifter instead of pushbutton like the H3. Push button 4wd is the gayest thing in the world. <span class="ev_code_RED">Well, first.... approach angle can be a pretty important factor. You can't get over the obstacle if you can't even get to it. You need to go look up the specs again, sport. Try to use accurate ones also. It's already been covered that many of the initial specs on the POS FJ were wrong. HP doesn't mean crap off-road. It doesn't really how much HP you have as long as you can apply torque to the tires. Sorry, if you were old enough to drive, you would know that. "Push button 4wd is....." forget about it, you're to dumb to even waste more comment on that one.</span>

Dude, you need to pull back and rethink your position.
No, I think it's you that needs to pull back and rethink your position. <span class="ev_code_RED">Duh huh!!!!</span>

Is your name Chris?
No, the name is Richard but it’s Dick to you... <span class="ev_code_RED">No, that would be Dickhead</span> </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

H2Finally
12-01-2005, 03:59 PM
Para, what restrain! You mustta really given up on this guy, since I think this is your first post which you couldn't even be bothered to give the correct numbers!! http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

H2Finally
12-01-2005, 04:01 PM
No, the name is Richard but it’s Dick to you... <span class="ev_code_RED">No, that would be Dickhead</span> You smacked right into the wall with that one... DICK!! http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

DTHVLY
12-01-2005, 10:12 PM
Originally posted by PARAGON:
Try reading comprehension next year...forget about it, you're to dumb to even waste more comment on that one...Sorry, if you were old enough to drive, you would know that...Of course, you would have to drive to understand that.
I really like how you avoid the issues by insulting me and insinuating that I’m not old enough to drive, you are so clever and quick witted. Is that your own material or did you have someone write that for you?

Just shut up, already. Go get some updated specs...You need to go look up the specs again, sport...Try to use accurate ones also...It's already been covered that many of the initial specs on the POS FJ were wrong.
I don’t know what the fuk you’re talking about but I got the FJ specs from SEMA and I also measured them myself at the FJ Ojai, CA event two weeks ago. If you have some different specs for the H3 other than those listed on the Hummer website then please enlighten us.

Well, first.... approach angle can be a pretty important factor. You can't get over the obstacle if you can't even get to it.
Approach angle is important, the FJ has 33.5 degree angle and the H3 has 37.5 degree angle both measured with the stock 32” tires. If you can’t do the math that’s a 4 degree difference, not much, but in case you missed it I did say that the H3 had a slightly better approach angle

It means it's not purpose built.
“Purpose built” Did you come up with that term yourself or did you get that from the all knowledgeable salesman at your local dealership? A vehicle that comes with a real transfer case shifter was obviously built to be a four wheel drive.

"Push button 4wd is....."
Let me guess; Push button 4wd is the best thing to happen to off-road vehicles since IFS and leather seats.

HP doesn't mean crap off-road
I think this statement sums up your off-road knowledge. If you think hp doesn’t mean crap off-road then you obviously you don’t know shiat about off-roading in sand or loose dirt. And what about the 73 more pound feet of torque the FJ has?

No, that would be Dickhead
Uh, the names Dick you’re the DICKHEAD...Try reading comprehension next year...

h2co-pilot
12-01-2005, 10:29 PM
DTHVLY (Dicktastesheavenly? - is that on your License plate queer?),

You're never going to win this one, just / yourself.http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

DTHVLY
12-02-2005, 02:35 AM
Originally posted by H2Finally:
Para, what restrain! You mustta really given up on this guy, since I think this is your first post which you couldn't even be bothered to give the correct numbers!! http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Yeah why didn’t he give the numbers? Hmmm makes you wonder doesn’t it, maybe it’s because he knows they would prove I’m right. I’ll list them for you just for laughs. These are for both vehicles with the standard 32” tires.

H3

Horse power - 220
Torque (lb/ft) - 225
Curb Weight - 4,700
MPG City & Hwy. - 16-20

Ground clearance - 8.5”
Break over angle - 23.5
Approach angle - 37.5
Departure angle - 35.5
Fording Cap. - 24"
Side Slope Cap. - 40%
Wheel base - 111.9”

FJ

Horse power - 239
Torque (lb/ft) - 278
Curb Weight - 4,290
MPG City & Hwy. - 17-22

Ground clearance - 9.8”
Break over angle - 27.4
Approach angle - 34.0
Departure angle - 30.0
Fording Cap. - 27.5"
Side Slope Cap. - 41%
Wheel base - 105.9”

H3 specs are taken directly from the Hummer site and the FJ specs were taken from the Toyota SEMA brochure as well as measured by myself at the FJ Ojai, CA event.

DTHVLY
12-02-2005, 02:43 AM
Originally posted by h2co-pilot:
DTHVLY (Dicktastesheavenly? - is that on your License plate queer?),

You're never going to win this one, just / yourself.http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

So now I'm a queer who isn't old enough to drive but has a license plate with “Dicktastesheavenly” on it? That’s ok I understand the personal attacks, that’s what people resort to when they have nothing intelligent to say to support their side.

BTW – DTHVLY stands for Death Valley just one more place you’ll never take your Hummer off-road.

PARAGON
12-02-2005, 03:57 AM
Originally posted by DTHVLY:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by H2Finally:
Para, what restrain! You mustta really given up on this guy, since I think this is your first post which you couldn't even be bothered to give the correct numbers!! http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Yeah why didn’t he give the numbers? Hmmm makes you wonder doesn’t it, maybe it’s because he knows they would prove I’m right. I’ll list them for you just for laughs. These are for both vehicles with the standard 32” tires.

H3

Horse power - 220
Torque (lb/ft) - 225
Ground clearance - 8.5”
Break over angle - 23.5
Approach angle - 37.5
Departure angle - 35.5
Wheel base - 111.9”

FJ

Horse power - 239
Torque (lb/ft) - 278
Ground clearance - 9.8”
Break over angle - 27.3
Approach angle - 33.5
Departure angle - 30.0
Wheel base - 105.9”

H3 specs are taken directly from the Hummer site and the FJ specs were taken from the Toyota SEMA brochure as well as measured by myself at the FJ Ojai, CA event. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Tell you what sport, go do you a little google search on the specs for each one and post the results of the comparo and then try to brag about how much better it is. Try to be less ghey at it though.

DTHVLY
12-08-2005, 12:18 AM
Ok, I know this is a Hummer forum so I’ll stop busting your balls. I guess well just have to agree to disagree about which vehicle is better off-road.
Getting back to the original topic of this Thread “Will the FJ be a threat to the H3?” I don’t know if threat is the right word but whether you want to admit it or not the FJ will be competition as far as sales go especially to younger buyers. The dealership I talked to already had a waiting list and deposits for their first 6-9 month allocation of FJ’s and Toyota won’t even release prices until late December. Like the H3 and H2 the FJ is a very capable 4x4 that has a novelty look, it’s the type of vehicle they will model diecast replicas and remote control cars after, so if for no other reason than it’s look it will be competition, off-road ability aside.
The way the H3 is a compromise between a luxury SUV and an off-road SUV the FJ is a great compromise between the H3 and a Jeep wrangler or wrangler unlimited. It has a shorter wheelbase like the wrangler unlimited but still has four doors and the options and refinement of a Toyota SUV.

Things I have considered before choosing one over the other.
_______
H3 pros
-Rock sliders
-32/33” tires
-crawl ratio
-rear locker
-approach/departure angles
-under body protection
-large recovery loops
-off-road lights
-sunroof
_______
H3 cons
-push button 4wd
-underpowered
-no GPS
-fulltime 4wd
-front end sets lower than rear
-poor outward visibility
-shock mounts hang 3-4” below rear axle (rock bait)
-GM quality
_______
FJ pros
-Rock sliders
-32/33” tires
-6 speed manual / 5 speed auto
-rear locker
-removable GPS
-transfer case shifter
-ground clearance
-short wheel base
-horsepower and torque
-heavy duty basket roof rack
-off-road lights
-115V AC outlet
-off-road options
-Toyota reliability
_______
FJ cons
-no sunroof
-blind spot
-color selection
-???

I know that a lot of you are diehard Hummer fans and will stay the course but there are at least a couple of you on this board who will not only consider buying an FJ but will be driving one next year.

Happy Trails…

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/Toyota_FJCruiser.jpg

Mr. I - Man
12-08-2005, 04:49 PM
Biggest CON

IT IS A JAP TRUCK

I cannot believe you post that pic of jap crap on DEC 7 Pearl Harbor Day.

Go die Now

Mike B
12-08-2005, 05:40 PM
GM trucks have a higher quality rating than Toyota trucks, so one of your pros is now a cons and one of the H3 con is now a pro.

Mike B
12-08-2005, 05:42 PM
And you don't think the sorry approach and departure angles are a con? Jeez.

H3 Hummer
12-09-2005, 07:05 PM
I got a new Truck trend magazine just yesterday so I wanted to add to this fun post.

This is all based on the Magazine info.

FJ Pro's -

a color other then blue

FJ Con's - (compared to H3)

Crawl Ratio - 40:1

H3 Hummer
12-09-2005, 07:06 PM
Maybe if they added the Harajuku girls this FJ would be better. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

wes1977
12-19-2005, 09:26 PM
Originally posted by Mike B:
GM trucks have a higher quality rating than Toyota trucks, so one of your pros is now a cons and one of the H3 con is now a pro.

Can you refer me to a creditable source?

wes1977
12-19-2005, 09:33 PM
I don't know if this has been metioned before but I found a pic of the furter H4 concept. http://www.okatuning.com.ru/images/oka-w-hummer.jpg

PARAGON
12-19-2005, 11:35 PM
Originally posted by wes1977:
I don't know if this has been metioned before but I found a pic of the furter H4 concept. http://www.okatuning.com.ru/images/oka-w-hummer.jpg Then why does the skid plate say H2?

PARAGON
12-19-2005, 11:36 PM
Originally posted by wes1977:
Can you refer me to a creditable source?
Is your "H4" furter from a "creditable" source?

wes1977
12-20-2005, 10:22 AM
Originally posted by PARAGON:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by wes1977:
Can you refer me to a creditable source?
Is your "H4" furter from a "creditable" source? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I would say no. I did want to see what it was going to look like. I stumbled on it not trying to find it at that point. Nothing is creditable about a concept.

PARAGON
12-20-2005, 12:06 PM
Originally posted by wes1977:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by wes1977:
Can you refer me to a creditable source?
Is your "H4" furter from a "creditable" source? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I would say no. I did want to see what it was going to look like. I stumbled on it not trying to find it at that point. Nothing is creditable about a concept. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Have you ever heard of the word "credible?"

Mike B
12-21-2005, 06:43 PM
Toyota and Honda are known to steal designs from US and European automakers, but this time it looks like Toyota stole the Element design from Honda and put on bigger tires and 4WD.

ETD
12-22-2005, 05:38 PM
I did read about the FJ Cruiser with some interest. The biggest "con" for me was that it will be a 2-doors vehicle (never mind the fact that it is not even for sale!). Why even compare it to the H3 which is a 4-doors vehicle? I just don't see the dilemna (sorta like deciding between a rifle and a shot gun when you need something to hunt upland birds). I did own a Toyota sedan once for about a year only but have not had any inclination to get another one. Did compare the 4-runner and Tacoma to the H3 before the purchase but the 4-runner appearance did nothing for me and decided that I did not want to 4-wheel in a pick-up.

ShaggyX
02-01-2006, 01:13 PM
I sort of like the look of the FJ. I am actually considering selling the s10 and 240sx and getting one...depending on availability and pricing (is anything set yet?). http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

DRTYFN
02-01-2006, 01:17 PM
Originally posted by ShaggyZr2:
I sort of like the look of the FJ. I am actually considering selling the s10 and 240sx and getting one...depending on availability and pricing (is anything set yet?). http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

You better set up a PayPal account and start begging(whining) for one now.http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

ShaggyX
02-01-2006, 01:39 PM
Originally posted by DRTYFN:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ShaggyZr2:
I sort of like the look of the FJ. I am actually considering selling the s10 and 240sx and getting one...depending on availability and pricing (is anything set yet?). http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

You better set up a PayPal account and start begging(whining) for one now.http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>As long as it stays below $30k I COULD afford it. Not sure I should...but that has really never stopped me before. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

ShaggyX
02-01-2006, 02:14 PM
Uh oh....MSRP: $22,890 for basic Manual/4x4. Don't have option package prices yet...but I bet I could keep it under $25k with everything I want. Now to work on selling the s10 and 240sx. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

DTHVLY
02-01-2006, 04:14 PM
Option package prices are on page 3 but no prices for individual options yet. I've heard it can be bought fully optioned for under $28K. Some dealerships are taking preorders now with a small refundable deposit.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/prices.gif
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/prices2.gif
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/prices3.gif

CslRkH2
02-02-2006, 01:25 AM
So a friend of a friend (I know that sounds sketchy) is in Toyota marketing and they are planning to take these around the country from April through November this year. They will be demonstrating it with professional drivers etc, at many of the most well known off road parks and areas such as Moab, Rubicon, etc. Evidently they will be traveling with a full support crew including mechanics and are looking for help (not sure what exactly they need). If you're interested and available during those months let me know and I will try to get you connected with her (the marketing person).

PARAGON
02-02-2006, 04:19 AM
Is she cute? http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

ShaggyX
02-02-2006, 12:12 PM
Do they need people that are available that whole time...or just a few weekends and evenings? If it is weekend, and is stuff that I could do (i.e. not mechanic stuff), then please let me know. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Thanks.

ETD
02-05-2006, 04:52 PM
I don't get it. They seem to highlight the "water-proof seats" a lot. I try to "go" "before and after" and not "in" although there have been moments where I could of wet my pants on the climbs. I think the biggest plus for it is the Toyota quality. Should give the Wrangler some challenge. I still can't see someone having that much of a dilemna between an H3 and an FJ though.

ETD
02-05-2006, 04:52 PM
I don't get it. They seem to highlight the "water-proof seats" a lot. I try to "go" "before and after" and not "in" although there have been moments where I could of wet my pants on the climbs. I think the biggest plus for it is the Toyota quality. Should give the Wrangler some challenge. I still can't see someone having that much of a dilemna between an H3 and an FJ though.

CslRkH2
02-06-2006, 01:02 AM
Originally posted by ShaggyZr2:
Do they need people that are available that whole time...or just a few weekends and evenings? If it is weekend, and is stuff that I could do (i.e. not mechanic stuff), then please let me know. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Thanks.

Sorry for the delay in responding, I've turned off all notifications...

It sounded like they wanted people for the whole time, but I will try to get more information for you tomorrow.

Paragon - I'll see if I can get a pic http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

CslRkH2
02-06-2006, 06:54 PM
Originally posted by ShaggyZr2:
Do they need people that are available that whole time...or just a few weekends and evenings? If it is weekend, and is stuff that I could do (i.e. not mechanic stuff), then please let me know. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Thanks.

PM me with your email address if you're still interested...

ShaggyX
02-06-2006, 08:48 PM
PM Sent. http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

VTSTOMPER
03-17-2006, 12:22 PM
My buddy saw one on the road yesterday - so they are out?

Ipedog
03-17-2006, 05:55 PM
None seen yet here in MA, but I'll be driving by my old dealer this weekend. Maybe I'll see one? http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Ipedog
03-19-2006, 02:13 AM
Maybe I'll see one? http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Nope. None in sight.

DTHVLY
03-20-2006, 11:07 PM
Many dealerships already have them on display but the official release date is tomorrow the 21st. I would go check them out soon they may all be gone by the weekend.

AZH3 
03-25-2006, 12:04 AM
Shaggy can I be your boyfriend?

CampMaster 
03-25-2006, 12:23 AM
I am deleting this section for it does no good to the Hummer community. I own this forum now so I will do what I please. Congratulations, you are all banned.

DRTYFN
03-25-2006, 08:32 PM
Originally posted by CampMaster*:
I am deleting this section for it does no good to the Hummer community. I own this forum now so I will do what I please. Congratulations, you are all banned.

NEOCON1
03-31-2006, 03:00 AM
LOL pad

Aubs
03-31-2006, 03:55 PM
I have to say I just looked at one of these today, and what a POS! It's the Fugly Jalopy. The model was $33,--- and it's so far from the quality of the H3 inside. Cheap, rough plastic crap everywhere, chinsy controls (the AC controls are so large they look cartoonish), and the seats and doors sounded and felt unappealing. The rear hatch was my favorite. It opened with a jumpy motion instead of a smooth flow. Not nearly as heavy as the H3 rear hatch, and when you closed it, the vehicle felt just as light.

Outside, the underbody has stuff hanging out everywhere, and the pumpkin in the rear looks like it hangs lower than the H3 shock mounts. Very messy underneath. I'll believe it's off-road abilities when I see it follow behind any Hummer on the trail.

EDIT: Perhaps I saw a model without underbody protection. I don't remember everything neatly covered.

For the cheap feeling of this thing inside, and the freakish looks outside, I can't see how this will be an H3 competitor.

So now, as when I first posted, the FJ Cruiser is no threat to the H3. Obviously, the vast majority of buyers will probably buy it "because it's a Toyota".

HoKC
04-05-2006, 07:36 PM
We have a Toyota Dealer across the street from us and one of their managers brought an FJ over yesterday to try and go through our test track. It made t past the rollers but did not clear even the log crossing. No way it was even going to be close on the step protion.

PARAGON
04-05-2006, 08:40 PM
Originally posted by HoKC:
We have a Toyota Dealer across the street from us and one of their managers brought an FJ over yesterday to try and go through our test track. It made t past the rollers but did not clear even the log crossing. No way it was even going to be close on the step protion. Why couldn't it do the log? Was it the front or did it high center?

NEOCON1
04-06-2006, 12:35 AM
saw 5 on a auto hauler today , NOTHING TO GET EXCITED ABOUT !!!! very eggy looking http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Steve - SanJose
04-06-2006, 12:46 AM
Originally posted by NEOCON1:
saw 5 on a auto hauler today , NOTHING TO GET EXCITED ABOUT !!!! very eggy looking http://www.elcova.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

And with those colors, just in time for EASTER.

I need to see one of these FJ's in person...

S.

KenP
04-06-2006, 03:58 PM
Saw one, didn't like it. Like the H3 better.

HoKC
04-06-2006, 05:58 PM
Originally posted by PARAGON:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HoKC:
We have a Toyota Dealer across the street from us and one of their managers brought an FJ over yesterday to try and go through our test track. It made t past the rollers but did not clear even the log crossing. No way it was even going to be close on the step protion. Why couldn't it do the log? Was it the front or did it high center? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hung up on the the cross bar protection in the center.

HoKC
04-06-2006, 06:34 PM
Interior

HoKC
04-06-2006, 06:38 PM
Drivers side view one door open.

HoKC
04-06-2006, 06:39 PM
Not much room to climb in.

HoKC
04-06-2006, 06:40 PM
Ground Clearance that would not even clear the log crossing on our track.

HoKC
04-06-2006, 06:42 PM
Strange operation of the rear door shock. It has a small clip that you are supposed to push to lock the door in place. I could not get it to work on this one.

HoKC
04-06-2006, 06:44 PM
Cargo Area

HoKC
04-06-2006, 06:45 PM
Spare Tire

HoKC
04-06-2006, 06:46 PM
Had to move the front seat all the way forward to get this much room to get in the back seat.

PARAGON
04-06-2006, 07:18 PM
Strange, the halfshafts go UP to the hubs instead of downward. The suspension looks like ground clearance wasn't even considered.

Those tail lights are going to be popped a lot on the trail, I would think.

HoKC
04-06-2006, 07:24 PM
Notice that part of the skid plate is a screen looking material. That is what it actually looks like, guaranteed to catch on everything and tear off.

Steve - SanJose
04-06-2006, 07:33 PM
Taillights look like warts. Got to believe it looks better in person than the pictures.

S.

DTHVLY
05-03-2006, 06:35 PM
Originally posted by HoKC:
Ground Clearance that would not even clear the log crossing on our track.

Just to compare, it's got an inch more ground clerance and a better break over angle than the H3.

Clearance on 33" Tires
FJ - 10.1"
H3 - 9.1"

Breakover
FJ – 28.9*
H3 – 25*

Originally posted by PARAGON:
Strange, the halfshafts go UP to the hubs instead of downward. The suspension looks like ground clearance wasn't even considered.

That’s kind of odd but it does allow for more lift without stressing the CV’s.

Originally posted by HoKC:
Notice that part of the skid plate is a screen looking material. That is what it actually looks like, guaranteed to catch on everything and tear off.

That's was the first thing I thought when the 04’ 4runner came out with that engine and skid, ”rockbait” but I guess those were put in to allow air flow to the under side of engine/oilpan. There is an optional frame mounted skid plate for the FJ that covers that one, and for the more hardcore there are some aftermarket ones in the works

blindzebra
05-18-2006, 06:39 AM
Sorry but I still don't know why one would want a shifter instead of a button. I may just be simple, but dmn it's quick and easy. When time is of the essence I'll take the button.

One thing I haven't heard anything about is the TCS on the FJ. That's one thing on all hummer's that makes a huge difference.

I'd really like to wheel with one, just to compare.

but I don't think my 3 will let me down!:D :D :D

Aubs
06-06-2006, 05:08 PM
I have yet to find an FJ Cruiser to wheel with. Here in Edwards, I see so many of these things (they're so ugly, I want to puke) and it's all like these guys who own the bikes shops or whatever. I see some Hummers here (actually, there is a really nice H1 wagon what a chick drives), but H3's mostly just pass on the interstate. Apparently everyone thinks they are too fuel hungry.

But anyway, I found Edmunds.com long term test introduction interesting. They are pretending to have an open mind about the vehicle, and already they're saying this:

Current Odometer: 1,912
Best Fuel Economy: 19.1 mpg
Worst Fuel Economy: 11.8 mpg
Average Fuel Economy (over the life of the vehicle): 16.9 mpg

I'm surprised to see it does that poorly for basically a two-seater.

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/LongTerm/articleId=115586

ShaggyX
06-06-2006, 05:31 PM
I would say the crappy fuel mileage is at least partially because it is quick for an SUV. More power means less MPG in most cases.

Also...out of curiousity...how many H2's did you see off-road in the first 2 or 3 months of its production? Adam and Alec were pretty quick to take theirs' off road...and even they waited 4 months or so IIRC.

Aubs
06-06-2006, 06:18 PM
I would say the crappy fuel mileage is at least partially because it is quick for an SUV. More power means less MPG in most cases.

Also...out of curiousity...how many H2's did you see off-road in the first 2 or 3 months of its production? Adam and Alec were pretty quick to take theirs' off road...and even they waited 4 months or so IIRC.

At least give me room for four passengers and crappy mileage. For example, the BMW X5 has a base 3.0 V6 that is poorer with mileage than the 4.4 V8 with VVT. So more power doesn't always mean less economy. The 4.4 X5 weighs 4927lbs. (curb) and is 16/22 according to EPA. The FJ 4WD automatic: 4295lbs (curb) with EPA est. 17/21. So you get two extra cylinders in the X5, another 700 lbs, .4 more liters and better MPG.

However, Edmunds observed 14.1 with the 4.4 in a power-bashing comparo, versus 15.88 in the Xterra/FJ showdown for the FJ at probably normal speeds.

Still, lb/lb, liter/liter it has less engine, poorer mileage. But maybe it's not fair to compare V6/V8 even if the V8 gets better mileage.

I'd pose to you, how many H3's did you see off-road within three months of the release? The H2 is a different animal in my opinion. I just want to see one of these things in action, and not stuck in a mudpit somewhere while rodeo music blares. http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp?articleId=7564&categoryId=1

DDWH
06-06-2006, 06:45 PM
At least give me room for four passengers and crappy mileage. For example, the BMW X5 has a base 3.0 V6 that is poorer with mileage than the 4.4 V8 with VVT. So more power doesn't always mean less economy. The 4.4 X5 weighs 4927lbs. (curb) and is 16/22 according to EPA. The FJ 4WD automatic: 4295lbs (curb) with EPA est. 17/21. So you get two extra cylinders in the X5, another 700 lbs, .4 more liters and better MPG.

However, Edmunds observed 14.1 with the 4.4 in a power-bashing comparo, versus 15.88 in the Xterra/FJ showdown for the FJ at probably normal speeds.

Still, lb/lb, liter/liter it has less engine, poorer mileage. But maybe it's not fair to compare V6/V8 even if the V8 gets better mileage.

I'd pose to you, how many H3's did you see off-road within three months of the release? The H2 is a different animal in my opinion. I just want to see one of these things in action, and not stuck in a mudpit somewhere while rodeo music blares. http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp?articleId=7564&categoryId=1

:D :eek:

The Green Lantern
06-06-2006, 07:37 PM
Now, that looks more like an FJ!!!

ShaggyX
06-06-2006, 07:54 PM
You can fit 4 Adults in an FJ fine...the door is kind of a pain, but there is room. Also, like you said...Real world mileage for the FJ is better then then BMW.

The only time I have seen an H3 off-road is Moab...April 06. So what is that...10 months after release (no idea what the actual release date was...just guessing June 05)? Does that mean that they weren't off-road before then? No. Does the fact that you haven't seen FJ's off-road mean they haven't been? No.

Besides...last I heard you thought a paved road going over a pass was a "scary trail"...so it might be hard to see other trucks off-road if you don't go off-road yourself...right? :p Just sayin.

The ArchiTexan
06-06-2006, 07:57 PM
:( :( :(

Aubs
06-06-2006, 09:45 PM
You can fit 4 Adults in an FJ fine...the door is kind of a pain, but there is room. Also, like you said...Real world mileage for the FJ is better then then BMW.

The only time I have seen an H3 off-road is Moab...April 06. So what is that...10 months after release (no idea what the actual release date was...just guessing June 05)? Does that mean that they weren't off-road before then? No. Does the fact that you haven't seen FJ's off-road mean they haven't been? No.

Besides...last I heard you thought a paved road going over a pass was a "scary trail"...so it might be hard to see other trucks off-road if you don't go off-road yourself...right? :p Just sayin.

I should hang you by your toenails and apply some tar and feathers for that last comment! I said it was a scary road. And you go up there and drive it. Your skinny-@ss Xterra can probably fit through just fine. I'll bring a convoy of H2's and H1's to meet you about halfway and see how you like it then. ;) It's not my fault the H2 is a fat-@ss.

I thought it was agreed that only double amputees were to try to sit in the back of an FJ. Oh wait, I forgot that Shaggy also considers adults to be cyber-chat-love-bots. So, yes, you could probably fit about 20 of those in there.:p

The H3's littered the last event I went to with my dealership which was in October, or 5 months following release of the H3. (I don't understand what I said that has led to this. I just want to find an FJ that will go wheeling.) At the last Toyota dealership event, I saw a camry with nice 22's and some FJ's climbing over the curb. Oh wait, they don't have events...:D

And that mileage thing, EPA says it's even. Edmunds probably floored the poor X5 and babied the fragile FJ. Even if the FJ is quick, if it handles like a marshmallow in the slalom, what's the fun of having speed? So you can have the VSC Nanny apply the brakes and start flashing the idiot lights? I'm just surprised it doesn't do better on fuel, 'tis all. :cool:

BTW, I have thrown a Land Cruiser into some hard turns, and the thing goes nuts. Everything flashes, beeps, and the brakes go on. I mean, it's probably trying to save my life, but it's annoying. And it's not meant to be abused.

BlueTJCO
06-06-2006, 09:49 PM
I should hang you by your toenails and apply some tar and feathers for that last comment! I said it was a scary road. And you go up there and drive it. Your skinny-@ss Xterra can probably fit through just fine. I'll bring a convoy of H2's and H1's to meet you about halfway and see how you like it then. ;) It's not my fault the H2 is a fat-@ss.

I thought it was agreed that only double amputees were to try to sit in the back of an FJ. Oh wait, I forgot that Shaggy also considers adults to be cyber-chat-love-bots. So, yes, you could probably fit about 20 of those in there.:p

The H3's littered the last event I went to with my dealership which was in August, or three months following release of the H3. At the last Toyota dealership event, I saw a camry with nice 22's and some FJ's climbing over the curb. Oh wait, they don't have events...:D

And that mileage thing, EPA says it's even. Edmunds probably floored the poor X5 and babied the fragile FJ. Even if the FJ is quick, if it handles like a marshmallow in the slalom, what's the fun of having speed? So you can have the VSC Nanny apply the brakes and start flashing the idiot lights? I'm just surprised it doesn't do better on fuel, 'tis all. :cool:

BTW, I have thrown a Land Cruiser into some hard turns, and the thing goes nuts. Everything flashes, beeps, and the brakes go on. I mean, it's probably trying to save my life, but it's annoying. And it's not meant to be abused.

BTW, a well set up Land Crus. would eat you both for lunch.......

Aubs
06-06-2006, 09:50 PM
BTW, a well set up Land Crus. would eat you both for lunch.......

Hahaha! In your dreams! :eek:

DDWH
06-06-2006, 09:50 PM
Now, that looks more like an FJ!!!

That's the FJ SR5 Limited, comes with chrome package and roof mounted grocery rack.;)

ShaggyX
06-06-2006, 09:52 PM
Hahaha! In your dreams! :eek:Put me in a stock FJ with just the option package (i.e. Rear Locker) and I could eat you and your H2 for lunch. Hell...I could probably do that with my crap-Terra. :p

BlueTJCO
06-06-2006, 09:54 PM
Hahaha! In your dreams! :eek:

no, not in my dreams.............:(

do you seriously not understand how bad ass a Land Cruiser is.......:confused:

Aubs
06-06-2006, 09:56 PM
I only drove one for two years... I never saw the "awesomeness" in it. Unless you mean modifying it. They're expensive things to begin with, have side steps that would come off on a curb, the trailer hitch drags on everything, and the 4WD was no where near as good as my H2. It's a grocery getter!

Aubs
06-06-2006, 09:59 PM
Put me in a stock FJ with just the option package (i.e. Rear Locker) and I could eat you and your H2 for lunch. Hell...I could probably do that with my crap-Terra. :p

You just wait Shaggy. You have it coming my friend. You and your cyber-chat-love-bots. You'll rue the day!

BlueTJCO
06-06-2006, 10:01 PM
here you go,

BlueTJCO
06-06-2006, 10:01 PM
rear,

BlueTJCO
06-06-2006, 10:02 PM
more,

BlueTJCO
06-06-2006, 10:03 PM
this one is tuff,

BlueTJCO
06-06-2006, 10:04 PM
I ran Spring Creek with one and it made Spring Creek it's bitch....it was not even funny......I'm sure it took some money to get it where it was at but there was nothing stopping it......

BlueTJCO
06-06-2006, 10:17 PM
turbo charged diesel engines
beefy ass solid axles
locked front and rear
front and rear coil springs

remove the side steps, a little lift, and boom.........

not to say that it's not the same as the H2......very capable when played with, but the Land Cruiser 80 series I had the chance to wheel with had my jaw dropping at every obstacle....:eek:

31_bandits
06-06-2006, 10:22 PM
This isn't meant as inflammatory, and certainly Moon seems like a nice guy and has superior photoshop skills, but:

what is the obession of

A) comparing wildly modified 4wd's to stock H2s
and
B) calling wildly modified 4wd's "jeeps" or "four runners"

its not a jeep anymore by the time it makes the internets glory-pages. and that's not a landcruiser.

Does the presence of a Supra or 10 somewhere in california that can run a 1/4 mile faster than an Enzo mean that Toyotas are faster than Ferarris?

What that landcruiser does has nothing to do with what a landcruiser can do, it has something to do with the skill, budget, time, and knowledge of the modifier.

And remember that, like an H2, a landcruiser is a really nice truck. comfy and reasonably quiet and smooth riding and you can put people and stuff in it and all of those.

and by the time you make the above changes, you'll have mangled some or much or most of those virtues...

so you haven't necessarily gained or improved, you've changed.


I admire the H2 for being such a good offroad machine AND nice/comfy/smooth/quiet. plus its cool.

Lets see a stock landcruiser outclass an H2. If it can, it can, and that wouldn't shake me up much. I've got 50 years left to be old and crusty and drive something germane, sedate, and acceptable among the tea & crumpets crowd.

For now, i'm just going to continue to marvel at the H2s ability to do what only it can do - generate an emotional reaction from basically everybody. :D

31_bandits
06-06-2006, 10:28 PM
i know this is the FJ/H3 thread, but it's ventured a bit off topic and if nobody minds i'll continue a bit O/T

does any non-hummer vehicle have guys like these guys that drive the Moab and rubicon and whatever trails in a stock truck that's still comfy/quiet/nice?

The Wrangler Rubi doesn't start that way, so its excluded (but the style is undeniably appealing, of course). Still, 99% of jeep offroad vids are modified, a good percentage of stock H2s seem to make film, no?

BlueTJCO
06-06-2006, 10:36 PM
This isn't meant as inflammatory, and certainly Moon seems like a nice guy and has superior photoshop skills, but:

what is the obession of

A) comparing wildly modified 4wd's to stock H2s
and
B) calling wildly modified 4wd's "jeeps" or "four runners"

its not a jeep anymore by the time it makes the internets glory-pages. and that's not a landcruiser.

Does the presence of a Supra or 10 somewhere in california that can run a 1/4 mile faster than an Enzo mean that Toyotas are faster than Ferarris?

What that landcruiser does has nothing to do with what a landcruiser can do, it has something to do with the skill, budget, time, and knowledge of the modifier.

And remember that, like an H2, a landcruiser is a really nice truck. comfy and reasonably quiet and smooth riding and you can put people and stuff in it and all of those.

and by the time you make the above changes, you'll have mangled some or much or most of those virtues...

so you haven't necessarily gained or improved, you've changed.


I admire the H2 for being such a good offroad machine AND nice/comfy/smooth/quiet. plus its cool.

Lets see a stock landcruiser outclass an H2. If it can, it can, and that wouldn't shake me up much. I've got 50 years left to be old and crusty and drive something germane, sedate, and acceptable among the tea & crumpets crowd.

For now, i'm just going to continue to marvel at the H2s ability to do what only it can do - generate an emotional reaction from basically everybody. :D

I admire them both.....and I really like the H2 and it's capabilities.........

but you are not convincing me that I cant compare a stock vehicle to a built up vehicle. If your going to get into wheeling your going to want to modify your vehicle at some point. So doesnt the ease of modifying that vehicle and the price of modifying it come into play somewhere? The H2 is good in stock form, YES! One of the BEST!

But show me an H2 with solid front and rear axles, e-locker front and rear, center diff locker, and some of the other doo dads they have. The Land Cruiser is very comparable to the H2..........trust me........

and a built up Jeep is in it's own league.....I dont compare them to an H2 because they both are very different with the angles they must approach and obstacle at, wheelbase, size, yada yada yada......A jeep is a Jeep and the only thing I'd compare it to may be a D-90 or a well built sami....

ShaggyX
06-06-2006, 10:39 PM
With a good driver I would say the following vehicles could make it through the rubicon based on what I have heard and seen (videos/Pics):

H1
H2
H3
Tacoma TRD
FJ Crusier (with DL and/or Atrac Options)
LandCrusier 80 Series (like the one Moon posted...but stock)
Xterra (05+ Offroad Addition)
Wrangler Rubicon
S10 Zr2 (with me behind the wheel)
Blazer Zr2 (with real tires...and me behind the wheel)
D90
Range Rover

ok...this list is getting too long...you get the point. I honestly believe that any Stock Truck in the >30" tire class, and a locker could do the Rubicon with a good driver.

As far as On-Road/Off-Road Creature Comforts...more or less just compare prices and you can tell which ones are more comfortable on road. Call $35k the comfy cut off. >$35k is probably posh. <$35k is not.

Just my unbiased (believe it or not) .02 :cool:

Aubs
06-06-2006, 11:36 PM
See, I agree with 31 bandits. Once you start doing all this stuff to a vehicle, it's become something else. Would you actually want to drive that LC around all the time?? It has to walk all over the place, not to mention the handling. In my mind, it's stock or nothing. Putting all this money into modifications is silly. I was just driving around, looking at stock LC's. There is hardly any room for articulation (same for the FJ), and there's so much overhang front and back. I had a '99 LC, and it was just not made for heavy duty off-road venturing. Unless you modified it. But then it's a modified off-road vehicle, not a LC. So all comparisons should be stock/stock. Maybe we should make that a rule.

Back to the FJ, I just want to see one following me or an H3, both COMPLETELY STOCK, and see which comes out on top. No mods. Just what the factory gave you.

IF, for some reason, you WANT to compare stock to ungodly modified, then both vehicles SHOULD BE MODIFIED. This comparing stock to modified is stupid. Because, obviously, the modified one will be better.

Besides, I could probably take an Aztec with 4WD, and make it into an awesome modified off-road beast. It would have sharp looks (don't cut yourself on the pointy edges), all the soccer mommy comforts (and air vents EXACTLY like an H2!), and it would look sooooo cool! :D

DTHVLY
06-06-2006, 11:48 PM
I just want to see one of these things in action, and not stuck in a mudpit somewhere while rodeo music blares. http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp?articleId=7564&categoryId=1

Stock FJ (other than ARB bumper) on Hells Gate and Potato Salad.
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/fjhellsgate.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/fjhell.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/fjpotato2.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/fjpotato.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/fjpotato3.jpg

Aubs
06-06-2006, 11:50 PM
Not you again. I thought you disappeared? You're the insane FJ fanatic.

Someone would know more about what those pictures mean than me. I've never been there.

I would say, an H3 would do it better!

Aubs
06-07-2006, 12:06 AM
http://www.4wdtoyotaowner.com/images/fj29.jpg

Awesome stock powerlessness!:D

I am in awe of the LC.

BlueTJCO
06-07-2006, 12:55 AM
Not you again. I thought you disappeared? You're the insane FJ fanatic.

Someone would know more about what those pictures mean than me. I've never been there.

I would say, an H3 would do it better!

it means that stock, that FJ just completed what your H2 will complete, stock...........

DDWH
06-07-2006, 02:45 AM
it means that stock, that FJ just completed what your H2 will complete, stock...........

COUGH BULLSH!T COUGH!

BlueTJCO
06-07-2006, 02:46 AM
It must be nice to get to drive corporate sponsored trucks that you don't care about for a living...btw, not sure that he actually "completed" potato salad without a winch line.

Don't get suckered in guys, the two FJ's pictured above are owned by Toyota, being driven by professional drivers employeed by Toyota and are more or less just advertising.

DTHVLY did you ever confirm or deny your employment selling FJ's?

S

P.S Neither pictured is stock, they both have aftermarket bumpers, aftermarket (and larger than available stock) tires, and I'm guessing both have done the switch to bypass the stock acutrac system.

and your going to tell me that "most" of the H2's that we see in your "videos" dont have bigger tires then stock, aftermarket bumpers, racks, yada yada yada?? Those look pretty darn stock to me, **** they have BFG All Terrains........:o And who cares what the driver skill level is or who owns the damn vehicle, they completed it..............

BlueTJCO
06-07-2006, 02:48 AM
COUGH BULLSH!T COUGH!

dude come on................you are so ****ing clueless if you think the FJ cruiser isn't a capable off-road vehicle. Toyota knows their ****.....Now the H2 and H3 and H1 are all also very capable and I'm sure the H2 would destroy the FJ offroad. But an H3 would be very easily matched.....

DRTYFN
06-07-2006, 02:50 AM
Stock FJ (other than ARB bumper) on Hells Gate and Potato Salad.

Hmmmm... no Escalator. I'm soooo surprised.:rolleyes::D
And I only see the FJ on PS. Must see video for verification.

31_bandits
06-07-2006, 03:30 AM
I admire them both.....and I really like the H2 and it's capabilities.........

but you are not convincing me that I cant compare a stock vehicle to a built up vehicle. If your going to get into wheeling your going to want to modify your vehicle at some point. So doesnt the ease of modifying that vehicle and the price of modifying it come into play somewhere? The H2 is good in stock form, YES! One of the BEST!

But show me an H2 with solid front and rear axles, e-locker front and rear, center diff locker, and some of the other doo dads they have. The Land Cruiser is very comparable to the H2..........trust me........

well not to be a pest, but all H2s have center and rear lockers (which i'm sure you know). PhilDs has a front locker, i think i'm going to spring for one as well, but i'm not sure when i'd need it. So the solid axles are the hangup??

As for the landcruiser -vs- H2 stock (H2 values for air suspension)

clearance: Landcruiser=8.3 & 9.8 depending on where you look, H2= (10 to rear axle housing, 10.8 rated)
The hummers are rated accurately for minimum ground clearance. alot of other vehicles are over-stated for clearance. several pickups come to mind (toyota tundra), the Wrangler Rubi is rated at 10.something, but is <9" to the differentials, same for the FJ, and so forth. For example, the big 'yota pickup is rated higher than the H2, i think, for clearance, but with the two sitting side by side i can't imagine how they determined this.

I'll go measure a landcruiser and post the results. and my hummer. with the same ruler. it won't be closer than 1-2".

approach angle: h2=43, landcruiser=31
departure angle: H2=40, landcruiser=24
breakover angle: H2=27.5, landcruiser=24

locking diffs: H2, center and rear
landcruiser: center only

crawl ratio: similar

The hummers suspension is more modern i'd wager, and i'd wager its traction control system also outclasses that on the Landcruiser.

And considering that in my humble, and not that impressive offroading, i've found times that the H2s approach/departure/clearance are challenged (though really not its traction except in mud), i shall humbly wager that the landcruiser will ram its nose into alot of things & generally not be a match for the stock hummer.

and its fairly gay, and doesn't cause a going-on-5-year panic among web-jeepers, both of which are fairly enjoyable traits of the H2 (non-gayness and jeep freakouts). ;)


With respect to the solid front axel. I am not an offroading expert, and certainly not as much as you may be (or may not, i guess), but i don't think that you always want a solid front axel. Driving fast on bumpy roads comes to mind.


and a built up Jeep is in it's own league.....

i selectively clipped your comment to be a pain.

I think a stock H2 could stand up to or beat at least the vast majority of build 4wds in an offroad "race" across a bumpy/tossy surface and i think it could climb steeper hills, and especially turn onto steep slopes. I suspect that the width and length = stability (center of gravity thing, draw some lines, if it doesn't go over the lines you're good). See, i think a "built" jeep would enhance both the strengths and weaknesses of a stock Rubi. So the things the H2 is better at it would only be more better at, and vice-versa.

I politely accept that your rig can do a great many things better than mine. And i'm not disrespecting it at all, but i think my butt-stock rig could outperform yours at many things as well. And in the places i've found to offroad, big rocks aren't, and big hills & bumpy trails are. :)

this message edited due to bandits hesitance over internet novicedom. It was more (but not impolitely) challenging before.

31_bandits
06-07-2006, 03:32 AM
i'm also sure / i accept / that there are times when two solid axles would be preferable.

and maybe there are tiems when independent front and back would be best, what do i know?

31_bandits
06-07-2006, 03:37 AM
it seems to me, just my two pennies, that to compare things, you can do any of the following

-compare two vehicles, whatever form they may be in

-cmopare stock vehicles. that would be relevant to jeep-vs-hummer. you'd need the same places (and a variety of places, mind) and the same or comparable drivers. and no 100000000% subjective jpmagazine BS, you'd have to simply have pass/fail for a series of obstacles.

-compare the build-potential of a variety of vehicles. what can be built starting from a jeep or a hummer or whatever. but even then you'd have to have the same person build the thing with the same quota of available options - or feasibly available options.


but you can't say "landcruisers rule" or "jeeps rule" based on a wild non-jeep or non-landcruiser.


that's like strapping a rocket motor on a sophia and screaming "kias are the fastest cars on the road!!!!"

ShaggyX
06-07-2006, 04:53 AM
FWIW...body clearance does not factor into "Minimum Clearance". Just because a truck looks like it sits higher...doesnt mean it has more Minimum clearance. Tire size and axle configuration are really the only 2 factors for Minimum clearance.

In the grand scheme of things I would imagine it really just comes down to personal preferance. For pure off-road give me a Tacoma TRD any day (in hindsight...that would have been a better purchase then the Xterra). That is probably my ideal configuration. 32's stock. Rear locker. Long Wheelbase. Minimal weight. Probably the perfect truck for me.

Put an H2 owner behind the wheel of an H2 and a Taco and the H2 will do better 99% of the time

Put me behind the wheel of an H2 and a Taco (bear in mind I have never actually driven a Taco...this is based on my experience with my former s10 Zr2) and the Taco will do better 99% of the time (I do not "Baja"...so that does not factor into the equation).

31_bandits
06-07-2006, 05:08 AM
yeah, i see your point about wheels + axle. the other clearance specs are dubious as well, though, as presented by alot of brands. Somebody should just take a ruler, an afternoon, and make a same-basis database, that would be funny.

i think i might take a taco in the mud. i also think the factory H2 tires suck in mud, and i'm not sure that the TCS helps yoru cause either, somehow i think i'd rather have wanton runaway wheel spin. but then i really am not a mud bogging guru.

anyway, i think that the "jeep-vs-hummer" as commonly presented boil about down to this:

look you guys, monte carlos are way faster than ferarris!!!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/76/Dale_Earnhardt_Jr_car2006.jpg

crazy bugger idiots that bought F360s!

:D :D :D :D


I think it would be interesting to sort of have a contest for stock vehicles, and also for build-potential with different vehicles. and for build-potential while retaining reasonable daily driver, or at least occasional street-driver performance. somebody should do that.

Aubs
06-07-2006, 06:20 AM
Stock FJ (other than ARB bumper) on Hells Gate and Potato Salad.
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/fjhellsgate.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/fjhell.jpg


http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/fjpotato.jpg


Not one of those pictures actually proves anything. There's no way to know if they made it up Hell's Gate, and Potato Salad, as others have said, probably was winched and maybe photoshopped! Notice that vehicle sitting conspicously in the last picture. It's aimed downhill, like it's winch might be facing the FJ...:eek: And I can now see the corporate tags!

I still want to see FJ vs. H3. I know the H3 would destroy the FJ. So where are the vids of an FJ not stuck in a mud puddle, and where's the FJ following an H3. That's what I want to see, and I still have not seen it!!!:mad:

NEOCON1
06-07-2006, 06:58 AM
its a freakin ELEMENT !!!!!!!!!!!!! LMAO :D :D

DRTYFN
06-07-2006, 07:06 AM
Ohhhh, what could have been.:D

NEOCON1
06-07-2006, 07:09 AM
yea we were really disapointed when he showed up in the x-mobile we really wanted to see the KY-cruiser / ELEMENT but he knew the X-mobile was way straighter ;)

NEOCON1
06-07-2006, 07:17 AM
here is the MOAB KY CRUISER check out that ground clearance

http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h69/NEOCON1/gheycruiser.jpg

Aubs
06-07-2006, 07:22 AM
here is the MOAB KY CRUISER check out that ground clearance

http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h69/NEOCON1/gheycruiser.jpg
Yah man, dat is de sheet right there. I bet you get reelly good gas miles because it got da more aerodynamics. I like eat. Dos reems are reelly nice too. When the policeman shoot your tyres, you can like go for mucho miles.:D

31_bandits
06-07-2006, 01:33 PM
you guys are funny!

BlueTJCO
06-07-2006, 04:48 PM
a ****ing stock jeep with 31 inch tires will make it hells gate, why the hell do you think that FJ didn't:rolleyes:

And to quote myself, "a built jeep is in a league of it's own".......I didn't mean that nothing compares or can outwheel them. I just meant, there really is nothing to compare them to. H1, H2, H3......those are more comparable to Grand Cherokee, Orig. Cherokee, Liberty.........models like that. The wrangler is not marketed or meant for families that are wanting to carry all of their gear in the car and go on a weekend wheeling trip. They fill a very small nitch for those who truely enjoy driving them but the only rigs I'd compare them to again, D-90, SAMI, G-Class (older), and other wranglers...........

AUBS, I cant wait to wheel with you.........:D you seem clueless kinda like JONNYHASMOREFUN and I enjoyed listening and watching that jack ass all day long:p

AND Finally SHAGGY.........I 100% agree with you....I think that the TACOMA TRD with a minimal amount of work is where it is at:cool: ....

AND my final comments about the Land Cruiser........I'm talking about a "built" 80 series cruiser. I am not comparing them stock to stock and I dont care to.........It has been a long time since I've been on the trails and wheeled with a "majority" stock crowd......it just doesnt happen. People here in Colorado that enjoy the hobby seem to build their **** and build it well. I dont even remember the last "stock" H2 that I wheeled with.......???????????............there are plenty of "poser" jeeps and "poser" vehicles in general around here but the majority of people that wheel here have "built" rigs.........

Aubs
06-07-2006, 04:58 PM
I may be clueless, but Johnny Carson was a funny man, and because John Candy was overweight my cousin became an IT specialist who founded the internet with Al Gore. Al Gore is my best friend. Al Gore says you're a doo-doo head. :rolleyes:

I probably am clueless, but I still have no idea why you'd want an oversized, tipsy monster of a vehicle. I know the bigger the tires, the more the things tend to walk on the highway, the higher the suspension the more body roll and less accident avoidance, and the whole setup begs for mechanical failure.

But you can have your modified beasts, and I'll stick to my better resale, highly comfortable, safe, low center of gravity, easy to drive stock vehicle which, since I didn't throw my money into uselessness, I can buy all kinds of fancy gizmos. :p

I do find it funny though that most everyone disagrees with this whole argument that FJ is god, and Mod is God, and thinks the FJ is a POS!

BlueTJCO
06-07-2006, 05:26 PM
I definately dont think the FJ is god and I think they are ugly and queer looking. But they do have the "makings" of a good 4x4 platform. The "pradas" have been wheeled over seas for a long time and are pretty kick ass from what I have read. I think the FJ is a fairly good off-road machine and would prob keep up with an H3...................I'm sure it wont be long til someone finds this out..........

I dont like "big beasts" vehicles or jeeps for that matter. I run a very mild set-up but it is dialed in well. I run open differentials with 32 inch tires and a 3.5 inch lift and can keep up with just about anyone on a 7-8 rated trail out here in Colorado. I cant even begin to imagine what my Jeep would be capable of if I decided to throw 8 grand into it:eek: ..... One thing I've learned is that Driver Skill and capability is 80% of it.............

BlueTJCO
06-07-2006, 07:31 PM
. "Most people that buy them just see them as a small SUV with a removable top and nothing more."

S

and thats not a niche in the market:confused: :rolleyes:

BlueTJCO
06-07-2006, 08:20 PM
and thats not a niche in the market:confused: :rolleyes:

no not missing any point. It's the ONLY small suv that you can take the top off of, and it happens to be a capable 4x4..............Can you think of any other vehicles on the market that can do that? Is that not "filling a niche"????????????:confused:

31_bandits
06-07-2006, 09:53 PM
One thing I've learned is that Driver Skill and capability is 80% of it.............

that makes alot of sense. and perhaps familiarity with wherever the driver is trying to drive?

WRT your comments about league of its own above & comparing hummers to other larger vehicles. That makes sense, but the typical web-tantrum aimed at an H2 compares it to ... wranglers...??? :D

blindzebra
06-07-2006, 11:44 PM
[quote=Mooncricket]a ****ing stock jeep with 31 inch tires will make it hells gate, why the hell do you think that FJ didn't:rolleyes:

And to quote myself, "a built jeep is in a league of it's own".......I didn't mean that nothing compares or can outwheel them. I just meant, there really is nothing to compare them to. H1, H2, H3......those are more comparable to Grand Cherokee, Orig. Cherokee, Liberty.........models like that. The wrangler is not marketed or meant for families that are wanting to carry all of their gear in the car and go on a weekend wheeling trip. They fill a very small nitch for those who truely enjoy driving them but the only rigs I'd compare them to again, D-90, SAMI, G-Class (older), and other wranglers...........

H1 H2 H3 are comparable to Cherokees? Um h1 particularly is so far away from that class it's just stupid. As far as the others, no I doubt that too. Very much.

DTHVLY
06-08-2006, 01:06 AM
Not one of those pictures actually proves anything. There's no way to know if they made it up Hell's Gate, and Potato Salad, as others have said, probably was winched and maybe photoshopped! Notice that vehicle sitting conspicously in the last picture. It's aimed downhill, like it's winch might be facing the FJ...:eek: And I can now see the corporate tags!

I still want to see FJ vs. H3. I know the H3 would destroy the FJ. So where are the vids of an FJ not stuck in a mud puddle, and where's the FJ following an H3. That's what I want to see, and I still have not seen it!!!:mad:

If you want to see the FJ completing Hells Gate the vids are on the Trail Teams site. OH yeah and feel free to post up your videos and pictures of the H3 even attempting Potato Salad, if there are any.

If you want to see an FJ vs. H3 then take an H3 to a Toyota Trail Teams event, and don?t tell me you can?t find them because they have been at every major ORV area and off-road event in the country since last November, and will continue to be through the end of the year, they even post their schedule online. You?ve been called out so check the schedule and show up.

http://www.toyota.com/vehicles/minisite/fjbulletin/index.html?s_van=GM_FJ_HOME_FJ_BULLETIN (http://www.toyota.com/vehicles/minisite/fjbulletin/index.html?s_van=GM_FJ_HOME_FJ_BULLETIN)

Aubs
06-08-2006, 02:13 AM
So why don't you post this crap up front and save us the trouble of arguing about it? Hmmmm!? And again, we do NOT want to see Corporately owned vehicles! They do anything they want because there are no real-world reprocussions. And who knows what hidden stuff is underneath. Since they're corporate owned and built, they could do anything for advertising... And I don't see Hell's Gate on that link, I see more mudpuddles...:rolleyes:

What I would rather do is invite FJ's along with a Hummer event, because those FJ-Fcukers could care less about an H3 and would probably send you towards doom if you weren't familiar with things. I'd rather go with some guys who I know won't show me how to systematically destroy my vehicle and then say "Oh, look, it can't do it! (giggle)". Besides, hanging with homos all day isn't my idea of fun. :D

DRTYFN
06-08-2006, 02:47 AM
You FJ bitches should keep your eyes on this site:
http://www.fjsource.com/

NEOCON1
06-08-2006, 03:30 AM
:D so who wants to be in my posse thats gonna crash the ghey cruiser party , that sounds bad :eek: .

who wants to crash a KY cruiser wheelin day with me . we can get some more pix of the KY's stuck in those lil puddles remember these ?

NEOCON1
06-08-2006, 03:31 AM
hell of a wheeler LMFAO you KY guys are a joke

NEOCON1
06-08-2006, 03:32 AM
tell me where to show up so i can really get a good laugh :p

NEOCON1
06-08-2006, 03:46 AM
now who has that shot of the H3 pushing that bow wake ? :D i think if a KY tried that one it would be doin that commander commercial , look at all the pretty fishies :eek:

NEOCON1
06-08-2006, 03:50 AM
where did all you trolls go ? :D and to the toyota trail team or whatever you call them .

this is me in my truck on hells and i still have over 3 years of payments left :D so lets party ;) freakin bunch of wannabee trolls , put you truck where your mouth is :rolleyes:

Aubs
06-08-2006, 03:50 AM
:D so who wants to be in my posse thats gonna crash the ghey cruiser party , that sounds bad :eek: .

who wants to crash a KY cruiser wheelin day with me . we can get some more pix of the KY's stuck in those lil puddles remember these ?

I'll join you! It could be a whole Hummer convoy! We should do it, because then we could completely counter the Toyota advertising scheme!!!! No better way to stick it to Toyota! Then, we could have our own barbeques too.

Aubs
06-08-2006, 03:52 AM
this is me in my truck on hells and i still have over 3 years of payments left :D so lets party ;) freakin bunch of wannabee trolls , put you truck where your mouth is :rolleyes:

I have much respect for that!! That's called trusting the Hummer to do what it's supposed to! :)

NEOCON1
06-08-2006, 04:01 AM
ok , Aubs and i are headin up the posse who's with us ? :D

Longriders mount up lets ride !!!!!!

Aubs
06-08-2006, 04:06 AM
We should probably spread this to the other forums to get the word out. Too many trolls frequent these dark pages.

NEOCON1
06-08-2006, 04:29 AM
i just posted in general 3 :D with a linky to here :eek:

HummBebe
06-08-2006, 04:53 AM
Sniff..sniff.. I smell a BBQ :D

FJ CRUISERS....THEY TASTE LIKE CHIKIN to mee!!!!


Count me in.

Racer-X
06-08-2006, 04:56 AM
I can't believe he is stuck there. It's almost dried up. I went throught that exact spot with and the water was rushing over my hood. No issues. (unless you count the plugged evap canister) :p

NEOCON1
06-08-2006, 05:04 AM
cool Racer , yea Bebe they all taste like chicken :D

Aubs
06-08-2006, 06:02 AM
Ha! Brownnose!
http://www.fjcruiserforums.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=1693&cat=500

NEOCON1
06-08-2006, 06:06 AM
they are funny over there on that forum :rolleyes: pretty stuffy :p compared to the freaks we got here :D

Aubs
06-08-2006, 06:09 AM
compared to the freaks we got here :D

Am I included in that category?

NEOCON1
06-08-2006, 06:12 AM
both of us are for sure man :D

Aubs
06-08-2006, 06:19 AM
both of us are for sure man :D

Yeah, I mean, just look at me:

http://shutter01.pictures.aol.com/data/pictures/04/001/6B/7F/3B/77/07GJ2CyvEt4aHTGj2vxdwUhK4w3lABK80161.jpg
I scare children when I walk down the street.

NEOCON1
06-08-2006, 06:22 AM
LMAO :D maybe you are a bigger freak than me ;) dont let CP get that pic she will give you some nice eyeshadow ;) and who knows what else :eek: you kinda got the Shrek thing goin on LOL

DRTYFN
06-08-2006, 06:38 AM
Yeah, I mean, just look at me:

http://shutter01.pictures.aol.com/data/pictures/04/001/6B/7F/3B/77/07GJ2CyvEt4aHTGj2vxdwUhK4w3lABK80161.jpg
I scare children when I walk down the street.

HOLY MISSING CHROMOSOME!!!!!

Aubs
06-08-2006, 06:39 AM
HOLY MISSING CHROMOSOME!!!!!

The lab technicians told my parents that one wasn't really important when they made me in the test tube. :D

31_bandits
06-08-2006, 01:08 PM
Hey you guys, try this:

the toyota tundra is rated at >10" of ground clearance, with my air suspension not engaged my H2 is rated at 9.9"

I measured them both the other day & took pictures, but the pictures didn't turn out very well. However, the H2 is ~10" to the rear differential, and with or without the rear suspension engaged the next lowest point is ~11" and is the front skidplate. the protection cage behind the skidplate is >12", and the rest of the underbody is 13-14" or so

The Tundra has an abundance of things - covering the length of the vehicle - that are ~9", 9.5", less than 9" and so on.


The same is true of the FJ and the H3. I haven't taken a ruler to those vehicles, but i've crawled underneath and used my shoe. My guess is that not only is the clearance of the FJ not greater than the H3, its at least an inch less. and the underbody protection isn't up to the standards of the hummers.

I recommend trying this at home.


And further, i recommend that somebody compare many different vehicles, all measured the same way, because the manufacturers specs for ground clearance are completely screwy.

i didn't find anywhere on an H3 with the offroad tires that was 9.1". maybe hummer rated it lower to differentiate from the H2. And there's no way in heck that the Tundra is 10.4" off the ground, and i don't care how you measure it.

same for alot/most of the vehicles on the road. i think ground clearance is best left to a ruler, and not to the internet and makers spec sheets.

31_bandits
06-08-2006, 01:25 PM
i recieved a "reputation" for this thread...

what does that mean? its 10 points as far as i can tell.

NEOCON1
06-08-2006, 02:09 PM
its funny how they never state the clearance from the bell housing or the shock mounts , those are usually the lowest points :eek:

NEOCON1
06-08-2006, 02:09 PM
hey bandits , you had a reputation long before this thread :p :D we just wont mention what it was

31_bandits
06-08-2006, 02:39 PM
hey bandits , you had a reputation long before this thread :p :D we just wont mention what it was

dammit!

i thought buying a hummer would help with that

http://soiland.no/gallery/d/3514-2/andrev_nerd.jpg

Aubs
06-08-2006, 05:37 PM
dammit!

i thought buying a hummer would help with that

http://soiland.no/gallery/d/3514-2/andrev_nerd.jpg

That picture effectively silenced this thread! :D

Must bear a resemblance to DTHVLY himself. No wonder he's turned to the FJ Cruiser. It might be his only hope! However, I think even gay men are a little more selective than that!!!:D

Aubs
06-08-2006, 05:39 PM
i recieved a "reputation" for this thread...

what does that mean? its 10 points as far as i can tell.

It means you're:
1. Cool
2. Managing to keep to the topic, as always!;)

31_bandits
06-08-2006, 07:29 PM
hey, thanks aubs.

Roktoy
06-08-2006, 07:42 PM
Being a former 4runner owner with 33's then i went with a few jeeps, locked F/R with 35's, now I own a hummer. Not sure why all the hatred towards other vehicles, I respect those vehicles, wrangler is a great vehicle, FJ is really good too, i respect any manufacturer that will produce a vehicle with a rear locker.
Anyway about toyota's they measure the ground clearance at the center of the front differential skid, which is why their ground clearance is overstated.

31_bandits
06-08-2006, 08:13 PM
Being a former 4runner owner with 33's then i went with a few jeeps, locked F/R with 35's, now I own a hummer. Not sure why all the hatred towards other vehicles, I respect those vehicles, wrangler is a great vehicle, FJ is really good too, i respect any manufacturer that will produce a vehicle with a rear locker.
Anyway about toyota's they measure the ground clearance at the center of the front differential skid, which is why their ground clearance is overstated.

I do not presume to speak for everyone, only for myself.

But i think what might seem like antagonism towards other vehicles is more reaction to hummer-bashing that frequents the web.

For example, the signature that i have on my posts currently pokes a bit of fun at jeep owners. I have always liked grand cherokees, they're good lookin (and wildly common around here, wildly).

I think jeeps are cool, and i think its neat what people do to make modified 4WDs, and i think all these different vehicles are neat, from 'Benz Gs to land rovers and beyond.

However, the behavior towards hummers of the online jeep community is (while fascinating) little short of deranged. Outside of the 100s of threads devoted to nothing more than H2 bashing, the preparation of videos with fake footage, and all of that, there are threads boasting about vandalism done to H2s, condoning violence towards H2 drivers and worse. Their behavior is completely preposterous.


Dig through to the beginning of this board - the old threads - people with no knowledge of hummers first or second hand come on the board, insult the vehicles, insult the owners, and get completely silly. And not silly like a room full of high school girls, silly like an idiot.

And as such, i think that hummer owners may tend to stick up for their vehicles a bit.

Plus, this is a hummer forum, and at least one member who is not a hummer guy has actively campaigned for the FJ against the H3, and i feel that the H3 is a better truck, and better built for offroading, and so i entered what thoughts i could in its support.


And i wasn't FJ bashing or Landcruiser bashing above, landcruisers are cool, very nice trucks. But they are no H2 offroading unless wildly modified.

And i dig wildly modified vehicles as well, but they aren't "jeeps" anymore, and that was my basic point.

31_bandits
06-08-2006, 08:24 PM
Also, to go along with that, Hummers are sort of on the opposite end of the spectrum of reviewer-darlins, like say BMW or Toyota or Honda.

a beemer will always get a good review, always. and they will get more than they deserve from reviewers, because reviewers tend to follow other reviewers and blah blah blah.

hummers are on the other end of the spectra. they tend to get "knocked" far more than is deserved. Outside of the H2, i think the H3 is the most underrated truck on the road.

From jpmagazine articles with no purpose beyond a) hummer bashing and b) whining about the cost of hummers to reviews by car magazine writers whining because hummers don't go 0-60 in 5 seconds, they rarely seem to get a fair shake.

And perhaps that leads to people wanting to stick up for their hummers a bit as well.

Short of interior space (only a bit worse than a typical other full-size SUV, and necessarily, as the H2 is shortened to produce those awesome offroad dimensions) & acceleration, the H2 gives up basically nothing to other Lux SUVs. Its quieter than an '06 Escalade (i measured both on the same road with an SPL meter about 20 minutes apart) on the highway, its more comfortable than any other vehicle on the planet in the front seats (personal opinion, of course). And it drives like an extremely well behaved truck, and isn't as carlike as other big SUVs can be (range or escalade). but you know what? it IS a truck, and i prefer the H2s driving behavior to that of the sports-car-fast Escalade. I accept that others might have a different opinion.

But find a review, and people will slander everything about the H2 to no end. why? preconception maybe?

and perhaps that leads people to stick up for their hummers a bit as well.


shrug

but i for one, and i think others also, don't hate/aren't hating other vehicles.

but sometimes reacting to the jeep thign with generally funny commentary. :)

BlueTJCO
06-08-2006, 08:38 PM
HOLY MISSING CHROMOSOME!!!!!

and I thought this was one of those "retarded kid" OWNED pics.....:)

Aubs
06-09-2006, 01:50 AM
and I thought this was one of those "retarded kid" OWNED pics.....:)

http://shutter04.pictures.aol.com/data/pictures/05/004/57/AE/40/26/p13rvcEr+x76jL164LUQCf0iS+XUA7uC0300.jpg

That was what he looked like AFTER my Agent took care of him.:D

NEOCON1
06-09-2006, 03:22 AM
hey Aubs , up for another night of jousting with these posers in their 2 wheel drive mall cruiser ELEMENTS .

Aubs
06-09-2006, 05:24 AM
hey Aubs , up for another night of jousting with these posers in their 2 wheel drive mall cruiser ELEMENTS .

Sure, but... where are they? :D

DRTYFN
06-09-2006, 06:57 AM
Oopsie.:D
http://www.fjcruiserforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=87565&posted=1#post87565

Sewie
06-09-2006, 07:11 AM
Oopsie.:D
http://www.fjcruiserforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=87565&posted=1#post87565

I think they like you over there. :D

http://www.fjcruiserforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=87368&postcount=32

Aubs
06-09-2006, 02:51 PM
They really are taking offense to our offensive. Perhaps we should strike harder and more often. Their inherent insecurity is beginning to show. I think they're panicing! :D

NEOCON1
06-10-2006, 01:21 AM
FREELANDER > FJ cruiser :D

Aubs
06-10-2006, 02:25 AM
I miss our chatty FJ supporters. They seem to have disappeared!

NEOCON1
06-10-2006, 03:54 AM
they start this crap and then wimp out :p :D guess we won :cool:

DDWH
06-10-2006, 05:22 AM
What happened to the KY circle jerker who was so proud of that retro rebirth amc pacer?:confused: :rolleyes:

DRTYFN
06-10-2006, 05:23 PM
What happened to the KY circle jerker who was so proud of that retro rebirth amc pacer?:confused: :rolleyes:

Huddled together amongst the other KY turds, hiding in a cave with a 20 year supply of Anal Lube 3000.

DRTYFN
06-10-2006, 05:28 PM
I think they like you over there. :D

http://www.fjcruiserforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=87368&postcount=32[/URL]

You missed V1.0 :D
[url]http://www.fjcruiserforums.com/forums/member.php?u=2954 (http://www.fjcruiserforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=87368)

DTHVLY
06-11-2006, 01:54 AM
And I don't see Hell's Gate on that link, I see more mudpuddles...:rolleyes:

Let me help you out with that, check ?April 16: Moab UT? video.

What I would rather do is invite FJ's along with a Hummer event, because those FJ-Fcukers could care less about an H3 and would probably send you towards doom if you weren't familiar with things. I'd rather go with some guys who I know won't show me how to systematically destroy my vehicle and then say "Oh, look, it can't do it!

That's a funny thought, I can see it now "yeah Aubs after you get to the top of Lions Back take a hard left it's just a small drop off you'll make it no problem," your a funny guy:D . The Trail Team guys are actually really cool and would never send you to your doom.

DTHVLY
06-11-2006, 01:57 AM
Oopsie.:D
http://www.fjcruiserforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=87565&posted=1#post87565
Wow, you guys got so bored with out me you had to go over and troll on an FJ site, it?s nice to know I?m so needed.;) To bad the threads were deleted before I could read them, I missed all the fun; I guess that?s the price you pay for having a life outside this forum. Anyway has anyone found those pics and or vids of the H3 on Potato Salad yet, just wondering?

Aubs
06-11-2006, 04:32 AM
Huddled together amongst the other KY turds, hiding in a cave with a 20 year supply of Anal Lube 3000.

Now, come on, stop making Shaggy cream his tighty whities. :D

DTHVLY
06-14-2006, 11:03 PM
The argument that those pictures don?t mean anything because they are corporate owned vehicles is ridiculous. They are still stock vehicles and while it?s true they might be pushing them to their limits they are not breaking them, other than scratched and dented skid plates the FJ?s didn?t break anything during there trips to Moab. The H3?s that went to Moab were obviously pushed to their limit and beyond because two of them broke their drivelines on a less difficult obstacle than Potato Salad. If the H3?s would have attempted Potato Salad they would have surely broken.

Potato Salad Hill is one of the most dangerous obstacles in Moab and any stock vehicle that can do it is the real deal. I have seen the video of H2?s on Potato Salad and it was impressive but it's an obstacle that favors wide long wheelbase vehicles that's why it would be even more difficult for the FJ because of its shorter wheel base and smaller tires.

Here are a couple excerpts regarding Potato Salad Hill

?Potato Salad Hill may roll more 4WDs than any other obstacle in Moab. It is so dangerous that the Red Rock 4-Wheelers no longer include it in the official Hell's Revenge trail run.?

?it is no longer an official part of the trail and is very dangerous. Several 4X4s roll there every year and countless more break gears, drive shafts and axles. ?

Rubi rolls
http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/8/web/572000-572999/572146_5_full.jpg
http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/8/web/572000-572999/572146_6_full.jpg
http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/8/web/572000-572999/572146_7_full.jpg
http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/8/web/572000-572999/572146_9_full.jpg

PARAGON
06-15-2006, 12:10 AM
If the H3?s would have attempted Potato Salad they would have surely broken.

Potato Salad Hill is one of the most dangerous obstacles in Moab and any stock vehicle that can do it is the real deal. I have seen the video of H2?s on Potato Salad and it was impressive but it's an obstacle that favors wide long wheelbase vehicles that's why it would be even more difficult for the FJ because of its shorter wheel base and smaller tires.Yer just a stupid one aren't cha.

So, the H3 would have surely broken on PS, the H2s did it because of their width and wheelbase and the FagJalopy can't because it's wheelbase and tires.

When you stick your dick in the tailpipe, do you grab and rub the taillights....

KenP
06-15-2006, 01:36 AM
I think a stock H3 could go up PSH. The two that broke were early run H3's with defective diffs. It's getting to be pretty common knowledge that many early numbered 3's had that problem.

HummerNewbie
06-15-2006, 03:21 AM
I have in all seriousness invited anyone from the FJ forum that is interested to come out to our event this month, so far noone has even commented on the thread.

They be scared of all you ******* guys and gals :D

NEOCON1
06-15-2006, 03:44 AM
hey dumb valley , if your test drivers didant break anything , it must not of been much of a test :rolleyes: thats the whole point in testing , to see what you can break . the true Moab expierience includes bustin your $hit a thousand miles from home , sounds like you are not up to it :cool:



FJ = 2 wheel drive mall cruiser

the proof is the 6 speed wtf ???????????? highway cruiser

all you need is a 3 speed for old school wheelin !!!!!!!!!!!

PARAGON
06-15-2006, 03:57 AM
The H3's that broke, broke on the golden stairs, which depending on your wheelbase, is equal to or harder than PSH...if you haven't seen/driven them both, then shut it Toyota tool...and once again ANYONE can beat a rig that they don't have to fix, it don't mean a thing unless you bring your own junk. Seriously, if a car manufacturer gave me a sedan and paid me to try and run trail with it, I'd sure as hell beat the rig until it couldn't go any further...as long as I didn't have to fix it. PSH is a tough obstacle, but not an H3 eater

I have in all seriousness invited anyone from the FJ forum that is interested to come out to our event this month, so far noone has even commented on the thread.

Swhere? linky I'll comment. Hell, I'd love to wheel with other vehicles, especially new ones that no one is sure what it's capabilities are.

DRTYFN
06-16-2006, 12:14 AM
OMFG!!! The hobbit has gone mad with power.;););):D:D

31_bandits
06-18-2006, 03:21 AM
i don't blame the FJ dudes for not hopping at the opportunity.

all this inter-brand rivalry makes me a bit leery at times as well. over the weekend i was advised by a guy with a really BIG jeep to air down to 3psi in my tires, and he said it was practically zero-chance that i'd blow a bead.

was he trying to help, or was that hand about 1/2" from his camera hoping the hummer would blow a bead so he could take pictures of it and spread them across all 31 continents in the nearest 11 solar systems as "proof" that hummers sucked?

How many times in america this year will some dude try to get somebody elses $70k H2 all scratched up just for kicks? it'll happen

His jeep was HUGE. he had 40-something inch tires that stuck out about 8" to a foot on either side. it was cool

and my hummer was too wide to really go on most of the trails w/o concern. An Audi could have driven some of the trails, and could have done it alot faster than i did in th ehummer. In that type of place, it would have been alot more fun in a jeep.

31_bandits
06-18-2006, 03:23 AM
or possibility of malice aside, wouldn't it be better / more fun to offroad with a bunch of people that you knew wanted you to make it up the hill and over the rock, rather than worry that somebody wanted you to fail?

i know you ******* guys would help anybody driving anything as best you could, but the FJ dudes might not be as certain about that.

I think it would be fun if i got one of everything and compared them. save some pennies.

Aubs
06-18-2006, 03:59 AM
or possibility of malice aside, wouldn't it be better / more fun to offroad with a bunch of people that you knew wanted you to make it up the hill and over the rock, rather than worry that somebody wanted you to fail?

i know you ******* guys would help anybody driving anything as best you could, but the FJ dudes might not be as certain about that.

I think it would be fun if i got one of everything and compared them. save some pennies.

Yes, I think you should go out, and get each of these vehicles and we can test them to the fullest of their abilities. Then we can truly have arguements. And you can have a thousand trail rigs. :D

31_bandits
06-18-2006, 11:26 PM
what would there be to include?

I'm not particularily interested in "wildly modified hummer -vs- wildly modified toyota" contests. That has nothing to do with hummer, jeep, toyota, or anything else. Given a few bucks, you could make a Geo Tracker a great offroad machine in the jeep mold, no? Same basic product when you're done, perhaps?

those things should have heir own brand, maybe something like "Wanger". What do you wheel? "A Wanger". that has a nice ring.

But you'd compare Rubicon, the 3 hummers, a pickup or 2 - maybe one big, one small, an LR3 or Rangie Rovie, a G500 and an FJ...

really, what else is there to compare? does anything else really lay claim to offroad excellence? I guess i'm short an FJ, an H1, a 'Benz, and a Land Rover, but could otherwise borrow (or already own) the other vehicles.

That would actually be really fun, but to be sure it would be the most honest test if the tester owned all the vehicles... minimize the prejudice and bribery that basically defines most reviews of, well, any kind.

Aubs
06-19-2006, 01:29 AM
what would there be to include?

I'm not particularily interested in "wildly modified hummer -vs- wildly modified toyota" contests. That has nothing to do with hummer, jeep, toyota, or anything else. Given a few bucks, you could make a Geo Tracker a great offroad machine in the jeep mold, no? Same basic product when you're done, perhaps?

those things should have heir own brand, maybe something like "Wanger". What do you wheel? "A Wanger". that has a nice ring.

But you'd compare Rubicon, the 3 hummers, a pickup or 2 - maybe one big, one small, an LR3 or Rangie Rovie, a G500 and an FJ...

really, what else is there to compare? does anything else really lay claim to offroad excellence? I guess i'm short an FJ, an H1, a 'Benz, and a Land Rover, but could otherwise borrow (or already own) the other vehicles.

That would actually be really fun, but to be sure it would be the most honest test if the tester owned all the vehicles... minimize the prejudice and bribery that basically defines most reviews of, well, any kind.

Well, there are some who say that the Toureg is a 'true' off-road competitor. You'd have to include that just to shut them up.

GLBLWARMR
06-19-2006, 03:10 AM
Cuase

DTHVLY
06-19-2006, 07:37 PM
So, the H3 would have surely broken on PS, the H2s did it because of their width and wheelbase and the FagJalopy can't because it's wheelbase and tires.

In case you missed it, the FJ did Potato Salad and didn't break...

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/fjpotato2.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/fjpotato.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/fjpotato3.jpg

DTHVLY
06-19-2006, 09:19 PM
I love how you guys try to rationalize it:
"the right side of PSH is hardly the most difficult thing in the World"
"he has made the easy part of PSH and nothing else"
You got to wonder if it?s so easy why have no H3?s even attempted it and only a few H2?s have made it up the quote ?easy part??

Not saying that it didn?t make it but tell me again where I keep saying it made it to the top?

HummerNewbie
06-19-2006, 09:47 PM
Not saying that it didn?t make it but tell me again where I keep saying it made it to the top?

Can not see where this could be construed as anything but saying it did but not in so many words.

In case you missed it, the FJ did Potato Salad and didn't break...

DTHVLY
06-19-2006, 11:54 PM
You can argue semantics all you want while you?re at it why don?t you check to see what the meaning of the word ?is? is and maybe we can figure out if Clinton really got sucked off in the Oval Office. Mean while the FJ has done more off road in three months than the H3 has done in over a year yet many here still try to marginalize it by labeling it a mall cruiser, KY Cruiser etc....

BTW-Not that you?re going to believe it but it did make it to the top; A-TRAC is a very good thing.

Sewie
06-20-2006, 12:27 AM
Mean while the FJ has done more off road in three months than the H3 has done in over a year

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: Give me a fukkin break! Holy troll statement!

Maybe I missed it, but have you ever explained exactly why you have such a hard-on for the FJ.

PARAGON
06-20-2006, 01:12 AM
In case you missed it, the FJ did Potato Salad and didn't break...

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/fjpotato2.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/fjpotato.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/fjpotato3.jpgIn cased you missed it, I was paraphrasing you, dumbdick.
I have seen the video of H2?s on Potato Salad and it was impressive but it's an obstacle that favors wide long wheelbase vehicles that's why it would be even more difficult for the FJ because of its shorter wheel base and smaller tires.
And all I see is an FJ ON potato salad where are the rest of the pics or the video of it completing it.

PARAGON
06-20-2006, 01:22 AM
You got to wonder if it?s so easy why have no H3?s even attempted itWhere do you get that no H3s have attempted nor completed PS? What makes you think one hasn't?

PARAGON
06-20-2006, 01:23 AM
BTW-Not that you?re going to believe it but it did make it to the top; A-TRAC is a very good thing.Not according to the owner

PARAGON
06-20-2006, 01:30 AM
Mean while the FJ has done more off road in three months than the H3 has done in over a year yet many here still try to marginalize it by labeling it a mall cruiser, KY Cruiser etc....
Now, that's just being stupid. To my knowledge the H3 has been, en masse to every major trail/ORV park in the US on more than one occasion. You post a bunch of pics of non-owners running some trails and the one or two others in the world that have done something and have the ridiculous balls to make that comment.

Oops, sorry. My bad. After further checking that does indeed fall in-line with nearly every other comment you've made here. So, it's nothing new for you.

Wisha Haddan H3
06-20-2006, 04:00 AM
I definitely think the FJ is in the same ballpark as the H3. On-road, the FJ wins ... but off-road it's all H3.

I test drove 2 FJ Cruisers a couple of weeks ago. The engine pulls strong and the driving position is very comfortable. Lots of headroom, shoulder room and elbow room (similar to the H3), and plenty of room between the gas and brake pedals (more than in the H3).

The H3 feels more solid around corners, has fewer blind spots, and has 4 real doors, but those are the H3's only advantages in town. The FJ kicked its butt in acceleration, passing, and on-highway agility because of its more powerful drivetrain. Both the FJ's 5-spd auto and 6-spd manual shifted smooth as silk.

Even so, I have no doubts about the H3's ability to smoke the FJ offroad. Its stance, clearance, skid plates (FJ's are plastic), wheel travel, torque/crawl ratio and turning radius (despite the FJ's smaller wheelbase) are all superior to the FJ. Once the 2007 H3s come out with the 3.7L I-5, its on-road performance will only improve.

As far as looks go, the H3 wins hands down. The FJ looks like a frikkin eggmobile :rolleyes: I'm definitely getting a 2007 H3.

NEOCON1
06-20-2006, 05:54 AM
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: Give me a fukkin break! Holy troll statement!

Maybe I missed it, but have you ever explained exactly why you have such a hard-on for the FJ.

X2 man you should stay over on your KY forum since you love H3's so much . who ever said H3's broke on tater salad ?

test drivers went right up it you DUMBA$$ :eek: check out the hummer test drivers pix if you really want to know what testing is .

NEOCON1
06-20-2006, 05:57 AM
:D

NEOCON1
06-20-2006, 05:58 AM
:p

NEOCON1
06-20-2006, 05:59 AM
now how about your plastic skid plates :( you gonna tell us how they protect a hundred times better than a H3's too ? :p

The Green Lantern
06-21-2006, 06:40 AM
How do like my rides!! :D

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i145/thegreenlanternh3/H3/DSC01195.jpg

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i145/thegreenlanternh3/H3/fj.jpg

hummthis
06-21-2006, 07:33 AM
The FJ is the best thing that could have happened to this Forum. Now you have something to talk about.

DRTYFN
06-21-2006, 07:37 AM
Kreskin says Iwheeldoyou will post next.

IWheelDoYou
06-21-2006, 07:42 AM
New here, love this topic as I just got back from an event (the GSMTR) where the Toyota Trail Team showed up. I hope to interject some reason to this (admittedly entertaining) thread.

Toyota has formed three FJ Cruiser Trail Teams. West, Central and East Coast. These three teams of two FJCs each go to off-road events large and small and wheel all the trails. Plus, they let drivers wheel them, and not just on on fire road stretches. They let you wheel them up obstacles. Very cool.

The FJ does very well offroad. It uses traction control or an e-locker to do this. It wheeled Moab. It did the entire Rubicon trail in STOCK form. See pics here: http://www.4wdtoyotaowner.com/FJCruiser.html. It's been to GSMTR, Hollister Hills, Paragon, etc. So there's no doubt it performs well off-road.

Quality: clear winner, Toyota. Not trolling here. Simple fact. Hummer isn't even close. Here's the link.

http://www.whas11.com/sharedcontent/autos/topstories2/060706cckrBizToyota.6468a31b.html

Whoever that complete dork "Aubs" is who keeps talking about the FJC "being a threat to the the H3", what the hell is that about? If you want to wheel a Hummer, buy one. If you want to wheel an FJ Cruiser, buy one. "A threat"? Ummm....ok. That's like saying chocolate is a threat to vanilla. Dumb! Or funny--like the brass at Toyota said: "When we build this FJC it's to kill the H3 line!" Ryyyyyt.

For god's sake, shut up and wheel!

Respectfully,

Mike

DRTYFN
06-21-2006, 07:47 AM
New here, love this topic...


For DRTY's sake, shut up and wheel!

Respectfully,

Mike


We just love to rub your newbie noses in the same sh*t others attempted to rub ours in.;)

BTW, how's Seattle?

The ArchiTexan
06-21-2006, 07:50 AM
The FJ is the best thing that could have happened to this Forum. Now you have something to talk about.


Welcome to the forum Humm! :D

DRTYFN
06-21-2006, 08:40 AM
Welcome to the forum Humm! :D

And buh-bye.:D

The ArchiTexan
06-21-2006, 03:06 PM
New here, love this topic as I just got back from an event (the GSMTR) where the Toyota Trail Team showed up. I hope to interject some reason to this (admittedly entertaining) thread.

Toyota has formed three FJ Cruiser Trail Teams. West, Central and East Coast. These three teams of two FJCs each go to off-road events large and small and wheel all the trails. Plus, they let drivers wheel them, and not just on on fire road stretches. They let you wheel them up obstacles. Very cool.

The FJ does very well offroad. It uses traction control or an e-locker to do this. It wheeled Moab. It did the entire Rubicon trail in STOCK form. See pics here: http://www.4wdtoyotaowner.com/FJCruiser.html. It's been to GSMTR, Hollister Hills, Paragon, etc. So there's no doubt it performs well off-road.

Quality: clear winner, Toyota. Not trolling here. Simple fact. Hummer isn't even close. Here's the link.

http://www.whas11.com/sharedcontent/autos/topstories2/060706cckrBizToyota.6468a31b.html

Whoever that complete dork "Aubs" is who keeps talking about the FJC "being a threat to the the H3", what the hell is that about? If you want to wheel a Hummer, buy one. If you want to wheel an FJ Cruiser, buy one. "A threat"? Ummm....ok. That's like saying chocolate is a threat to vanilla. Dumb! Or funny--like the brass at Toyota said: "When we build this FJC it's to kill the H3 line!" Ryyyyyt.

For god's sake, shut up and wheel!

Respectfully,

Mike


LMAO!!! :D :D Those are test vehicles, heck I'll drive a Rolls Royce if someone is paying for it and not worrying about getting damage. And those FJ's in Moab are modifieds.....lol. I wonder what it looks like after completing the Rubicon trail...hmm probably in the repair shop! :D

HummerNewbie
06-21-2006, 03:44 PM
It's been to GSMTR, Hollister Hills, Paragon, etc. So there's no doubt it performs well off-road.

Just because it has been there and wheeled does not mean it performed well. Not saying it did bad or good but just having been there doesn't prove anything :rolleyes:



Quality: clear winner, Toyota. Not trolling here. Simple fact. Hummer isn't even close. Here's the link.

Again, doesn't prove anything. It is too early to tell what the quality of the FJ will be and that is what we are discussing. For the record, the worst quality rated vehicle that GM sells is manufactured in a Toyota plant :eek:

To each their own on what they want to drive and for me it will never be an FJ but wouldn't mind wheeling with some.

h2co-pilot
06-21-2006, 03:47 PM
X2 man you should stay over on your KY forum since you love H3's so much . who ever said H3's broke on tater salad ?

test drivers went right up it you DUMBA$$ :eek: check out the hummer test drivers pix if you really want to know what testing is .

I think you can type dumbass. I'm pretty sure. Lemme check:

dumbass

h2co-pilot
06-21-2006, 03:47 PM
Yep. Type dumbass all you want.

Carry on.:D

IWheelDoYou
06-21-2006, 05:22 PM
The ones that went on the Rubicon were modded as well :rolleyes:

S

Totally wrong. They were stock except for tires (more aggressive tread but OEM size). Roll your eyes when you open them--the photos clearly show it stock, and MANY pubs have written up the FJC on the Rubicon story.

HummerNewbie
06-21-2006, 05:28 PM
...MANY pubs have written up the FJC on the Rubicon story.

Of course they have. The pubs love Toyota and would probably right a favorable review on anything with a Yota badge on it. I have not seen any of the FJ Rubicon reports but in general, that's how it is.

IWheelDoYou
06-21-2006, 05:33 PM
I'd like to see each of the tough guy talkers here to post just one photo of their personal rig in tough offroad action.

Ain't gonna happen cos they don't wheel, they WEB wheel. :rolleyes:

That goes for post-erasing admins, too. :p

The ArchiTexan
06-21-2006, 05:38 PM
I'd like to see each of the tough guy talkers here to post just one photo of their personal rig in tough offroad action.

Ain't gonna happen cos they don't wheel, they WEB wheel. :rolleyes:

That goes for post-erasing admins, too. :p


Hi, I wheeled with my stock FJ, in fact I made it through MOAB with a low ride kit on!! :D pretty amazing wow!

HummerNewbie
06-21-2006, 05:41 PM
You had a post erased? Takes a lot for that to happen around here.

Not that this shot is anything serious (have to find the better shots) nor have I claimed to do serious wheeling but at least I get it dirty.

IWheelDoYou
06-21-2006, 05:42 PM
Of course they have. The pubs love Toyota and would probably right a favorable review on anything with a Yota badge on it. I have not seen any of the FJ Rubicon reports but in general, that's how it is.

Ya gotta love guys who admit they never read the item but still post an opinion on it. LOL. Anyway, the point was, the mags all confirmed the FJC was stock--we're not talking about how they said it performed. However, here's the basic lowdown:

There was only ONE FJ Cruiser on that particular trip. Driver was Joe Bacal, spotter was Bill Burke (anyone who wheels knows who Bill Burke is, those who don't go to http://www.bb4wa.com). FJC in question was the actual prototype version worth some $250,000. Bacal was apparently under orders NOT to trash it cos of that reason! Crazy--they tell you to drive the Con in a stock FJC, but "don't do any damage to it." Hello, pressure!

Well, they did it. They did have to winch and use the Hi-Lift jack in spots; they didn't just walk on through. But the stock FJ Cruiser made it undamaged. One more fact, one publication, http://www.4wdtoyotoaowner.com, says that they did do an electrical mod that let the ATRAC work with the E-locker. (Production versions you use one or the other, not both together.

I'd be interested in seeing a stock H3 do the Con. I'M NOT SAYING IT CAN'T!! Just like to see the pics of it there, in action, stock.

IWheelDoYou
06-21-2006, 05:42 PM
You had a post erased? Takes a lot for that to happen around here.

Not that this shot is anything serious (have to find the better shots) nor have I claimed to do serious wheeling but at least I get it dirty.

Cool shot, glad you wheel your rig!

IWheelDoYou
06-21-2006, 06:27 PM
And don't forget about the override of the traction control system...and the tires were a HUGE improvement over what is the stock offering.

I stand by my :rolleyes:

S

Not that you knew any of that prior to me telling you. LOL. What's funny is, if you read Bacal's piece, you'd learn that he NEVER used the e-locker!! HAHAHA. It was ATRAC the whole time; the engineers did the tweak and he never used them together. So put that in your pipe and smoke it. :rolleyes:

Glad you posted a wheeling pic--of your wife--though my old Subaru Outback could do that stretch. :D

IWheelDoYou
06-21-2006, 06:28 PM
Nice wheeling pics, PhilD!

IWheelDoYou
06-21-2006, 06:32 PM
Oh heck, here's one more :D

http://www.*******club.com/events/040221/john/images/024.jpg

BTW, other than the roof rack...it's bone stock and we got our first trail damage with the dealer tags on it :D

S

Splashing through mud puddles aint wheeling dude and gets you a well-deserved :rolleyes:

Cool that you get it dirty. I'll give ya that. :cool:

Ipedog
06-21-2006, 06:32 PM
I'd like to see each of the tough guy talkers here to post just one photo of their personal rig in tough offroad action.

Ain't gonna happen cos they don't wheel, they WEB wheel.

That goes for post-erasing admins, too.
I haven't "talked tough", could care less who I wheel with provided its with friendly people, think the "my brand is better than your brand" thing is total bullsh1t...

So, to your web wheeler comment I give you these:

http://ipedog.smugmug.com/photos/72768578-L.jpg

http://ipedog.smugmug.com/photos/72773491-L.jpg

http://www.elcovaforums.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=21655&stc=1&d=1148942310

And just so that you don't say all I'm posting is me

http://ipedog.smugmug.com/photos/66137480-L.jpg

http://ipedog.smugmug.com/photos/66143339-L.jpg


This whole damned thing is stupid. The FJ is going to be a great truck. The H3 is a great truck. I'm actually jealous of the volume of suspension lifts, winch bumpers, etc. that are already available for the FJ.

Lets just put the BS away and have a great time wheeling our trucks, okay?

IWheelDoYou
06-21-2006, 06:36 PM
And the pics you are gonna post of your truck doing something my wife can't are where? (BTW, I never said I drive, I spot and try and keep others from breaking their junk...it's what I do :) ) and I posted about the traction mod prior to reading your post...the driver has since admitted that he infact did use it...and Bill Burke has turned into something of a tool these days :D

S

Wow.

Your last sentence proves that ALL of your posts are not worth reading. If you think Bill Burke is "a tool"--a guy who literally does more wheeling in a single month than you (or any of us) does in a year--then you're simply a fool. Bill Burke's skills stand for themselves. Camel Trophy driver for the USA alone gets him huge respect, and to this day he wheels all year, all the time., in places you couldn't possibly even comprehend.

Dis him, and you just make yourself look stupid. And not just from that mud puddle splash photo :p

The Green Lantern
06-21-2006, 06:56 PM
I don't do the rocks but this one .....

PARAGON
06-21-2006, 07:01 PM
I'd like to see each of the tough guy talkers here to post just one photo of their personal rig in tough offroad action.

Ain't gonna happen cos they don't wheel, they WEB wheel. :rolleyes:

That goes for post-erasing admins, too. :pIt feels very weird. People coming to a Hummer forum looking for off-road validation.

PARAGON
06-21-2006, 07:02 PM
Wow.

Your last sentence proves that ALL of your posts are not worth reading. If you think Bill Burke is "a tool"--a guy who literally does more wheeling in a single month than you (or any of us) does in a year--then you're simply a fool. Bill Burke's skills stand for themselves. Camel Trophy driver for the USA alone gets him huge respect, and to this day he wheels all year, all the time., in places you couldn't possibly even comprehend.

Dis him, and you just make yourself look stupid. And not just from that mud puddle splash photo :pLook ma! No brain!

HummerNewbie
06-21-2006, 07:27 PM
Ya gotta love guys who admit they never read the item but still post an opinion on it.

I assume you are talking about me and if you are, could you please point out where I posted an opinion on the item :confused:


I'd be interested in seeing a stock H3 do the Con. I'M NOT SAYING IT CAN'T!! Just like to see the pics of it there, in action, stock.

Wasn't the Con one of the testing grounds for the H3. Have not read beyond this post but I am sure someone has or will post about that.

Cool shot, glad you wheel your rig!

Thanks :)

IWheelDoYou
06-21-2006, 08:33 PM
Here ya go.

And btw, I NEVER have said that Hummers can't wheel in any of my posts.

And in advance, for all the flamers:

:rolleyes: x6
:confused: x2
:D x 5
:p x6

Cheers!

IWheelDoYou
06-21-2006, 08:38 PM
Warn M12000 winch
Winchline 3/8" synthetic rope and thimble
Pro Comp 35" Mud Terrains
4" lift
Old Man Emu suspension
ARB bull bar
Locking diffs front and rear
Slee Offroad T-case plate
Slee Offroad A/C drier plate
Longfield birfields and axles
Kaymar rear bumper/swing away tire carrier
4+Plus rock sliders
Aussie DBA rotors and pads
60" Hi-Lift

Photos: Moab, Reiter

I wheel, do you?:D

HummerNewbie
06-21-2006, 10:38 PM
Here ya go.

And btw, I NEVER have said that Hummers can't wheel in any of my posts.


Cheers!

Nice rig. Don't know what it has to do with the FJ :p but nice rig none the less. Not sure that anyone thought you were saying Hummers couldn't wheel but I also don't think anyone here said FJs couldn't either. Lets settle this once and for all, come to FL and we will wheel :D

DTHVLY
06-22-2006, 01:06 AM
who ever said H3's broke on tater salad ? test drivers went right up it you DUMBA$$ check out the hummer test drivers pix if you really want to know what testing is.
No one said the H3 broke on PSH because an H3 has never even attempted it, if you have pics or vids that prove otherwise feel free to post them up.

now how about your plastic skid plates you gonna tell us how they protect a hundred times better than a H3's too ?
Plastic skid plates? Come on why not go the full nine and claim the FJ has plastic rock rails and tinfoil tow hooks.

Bill Burke has turned into something of a tool these days
So now that you have resorted to calling one of the greatest wheelers in history a tool in a futile attempt to discredit the FJ and preserve the belief that the Hummer is ?Like nothing else? what?s next?

Well, that there is just about the most modified FJ Cruiser ever isn't it...:confused:
That's a Landcruiser FZJ80 not and FJ Cruiser. They look so much a like.:rolleyes:

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/lancruiser2.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/yotataco/FJ%20Revtek/fjmoab11.jpg

PARAGON
06-22-2006, 01:18 AM
And btw, I NEVER have said that Hummers can't wheel in any of my posts.

No, what you said was this.I'd like to see each of the tough guy talkers here to post just one photo of their personal rig in tough offroad action.

Ain't gonna happen cos they don't wheel, they WEB wheel.You are a homosexual, aren't you.

PARAGON
06-22-2006, 01:21 AM
That's a Landcruiser FZJ80 not and FJ Cruiser. They look so much a like.:rolleyes:
and the boyfried is back

Ummm..... and that was called sarcasm on sfox's part, sorry such things are lost on you.

DRTYFN
06-22-2006, 02:46 AM
WAAAAA....and my opinion on Bill is founded on a looooong story...but I still haven't seen any pics of your stupid AE-mobile.

S

X2

DRTYFN
06-22-2006, 02:49 AM
Warn M12000 winch
Winchline 3/8" synthetic rope and thimble
Pro Comp 35" Mud Terrains
4" lift
Old Man Emu suspension
ARB bull bar
Locking diffs front and rear
Slee Offroad T-case plate
Slee Offroad A/C drier plate
Longfield birfields and axles
Kaymar rear bumper/swing away tire carrier
4+Plus rock sliders
Aussie DBA rotors and pads
60" Hi-Lift

Photos: Moab, Reiter

I wheel, do you?:D

That sure is a nice list of modifications just to make the KY wheelable.:rolleyes:
BTW, where are your wheeling pics?

HummBebe
06-22-2006, 03:03 AM
I'd be interested in seeing a stock H3 do the Con. I'M NOT SAYING IT CAN'T!! Just like to see the pics of it there, in action, stock.

Come back in a month:D

here is CHICK wheeler in an H3, in Moab...
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a240/HummBeeBe/BebeStairs.jpg

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a240/HummBeeBe/BebeHellsGate.jpg

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a240/HummBeeBe/BebeBIGLedge.jpg

I also own an '95 FZJ80, maybe you can help me figure out the mods I need to do so it will do this!

My truck is stock, except tires:D

NEOCON1
06-22-2006, 03:20 AM
mine too and here it is again ass pipe :D

NEOCON1
06-22-2006, 03:25 AM
2 more for you pen1s breath :p


http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h69/NEOCON1/goldencrack1.jpg
http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h69/NEOCON1/moab4-06141.jpg


now lets see your sh1thead :eek:

PARAGON
06-22-2006, 03:42 AM
mine too and here it is again ass pipe :DI like how Alan is saying, "Down boy, down boy." :D