I've gone "head to head" as you would say, with a couple Rubicon owners myself. I got much farther, with less damage, and made it look much easier then any of them did. (Eagle Rock) I would guarantee that a Rubicon (other than the height) is much more capable of a vehicle then my TJ. So, again, IMHO......Driver 60%.....RIG 40%...... I'll keep throwing that out there cause this "anyone wanna challenge a rubicon" crap is kinda funny to me..........I'm open front and rear, and run a Dana 35c, anyone want some.?????

I think this would depend on where you live. Around here most of the ones I see have been either built up more to wheel or wheeled hard stock.

In other parts of the country I bet its the other way around.

To be honest I have the same problem with lots of Rubicon owners and I do H2 owners.

The 5 or 10% of people who buy them because they look cool or because its the cool thing to do are jerks. Almost always.

Same thing with hummers. Im sure you guys who wheel your H2s hard are cool people. Most likely you aren't the pretentous type of ******* that gives the H2 its bad name in the wheeling world.

But without knowing true numbers I would be willing to bet that you unpretentous non-*******s that wheel your hummers make up about 5-10% of all the H2s sold.

So basicly you guys here are really getting the short end of the shaft...

Not only do you have to defend the fact that you wheel your rigs but you also have to defend the fact that you aren't a pretentous ******* with a big wallet and a small peter.
Thats gotta be rough...

You got the attitude because you're full of **** and you're lieing.You came here to start trouble, not check our attitudes. You're a lieing sack of ****.

I think this would depend on where you live. Around here most of the ones I see have been either built up more to wheel or wheeled hard stock.

In other parts of the country I bet its the other way around.

To be honest I have the same problem with lots of Rubicon owners and I do H2 owners.

The 5 or 10% of people who buy them because they look cool or because its the cool thing to do are jerks. Almost always.

Same thing with hummers. Im sure you guys who wheel your H2s hard are cool people. Most likely you aren't the pretentous type of ******* that gives the H2 its bad name in the wheeling world.

But without knowing true numbers I would be willing to bet that you unpretentous non-*******s that wheel your hummers make up about 5-10% of all the H2s sold.

So basicly you guys here are really getting the short end of the shaft...

Not only do you have to defend the fact that you wheel your rigs but you also have to defend the fact that you aren't a pretentous ******* with a big wallet and a small peter.
Thats gotta be rough... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You are spot on about those here that wheel their H2s are cool. You are also correct that it is probably close to 10% of H2 owners that will take them off road, at least around here. In the overall Jeep market, I would guess that the figure isn't much higher. That is too bad for both brands. As far as your mentioning in the previous post that the Hummer owners are say that "Me and My Hummer are better than you are" (or something to that effect) really isn't true. Not from the people here that is. If you read through the thread, you don't really find comments like that IMHO. For the most part, the members of this forum and the first to say to those that drive other vehicles, just come on out with us to wheel, we will show you what it can do and you decide and we will all have a good time. If we all just stop this pissing match, there could probably be some great friendships built here.

I would venture to say it's pretty much the same everywhere regardless of what kind of vehicle you drive.

A good percentage of people buy "capable" off road vehicles because they think they look cool or because they buy into the outdoorsy vehicle marketing.

A smaller percentage of those same people then take thos vehicles and bolt all kinds of aftermarket parts onto them so they look (maybe are) even more capable off road.

A still smaller percentage of those same people will actually take those vehicles off road and demonstrate that they (the individual, not the vehicle) have very little capability offroad.

This last group makes up the bulk of the web wheelers on most Internet forums, IMO. They talk about modifications. They talk about how to wheel. They talk a lot but if/when you meet them in person you find out the truth.

Finally, there is a very small percentage of people who buy off road-capable vehicles to use them off road. Some of them modify the vehicles. Some of them build them from the ground up. Some of them buy them and wheel them stock right off the dealer's lot.

Internet forums have given us the good, the bad and the ugly. Good: those who want to wheel and modify their vehicles have a better means of communication than ever before. Bad: hordes of Web Wheelers are out there bragging about stuff they've never done and giving advice they're not qualified to give. The Ugly: Once in a while the Internet enables a "War of the Roses" and neither side is big enough to step back and let it end.

H2's suck.....I towed one out once. Hey did anyone see that video of the H2 breaking the Tie Rod? THose tie rods sure are weak. You have to have a small dick to own or even want to buy an H2....... Feeling any more feisty?

I don't like Rubicon's because my airhead sister in law bought one. It's called cognitive dissonance...displaced anger. If I think through it I realize it's not the ride I dislike. DrMoab, et al, have suggested similar by sighting perceived attitudes of the drivers and insisting he hates the ride. I detect similar on the Hummer side towards Jeeps.

Me, I've been a gearhead all my life and because I do have some disposable income I like different rides and owned and own a lot of them. So I guess I'm one of those so-called pinhead Hummer owners who bought the H2 simply because it's well, the H2 and I can afford it and I didn't want a more...established...Suburban and the Jeep was too small.

I remember when I bouught a 94 Viper roadster and started autocrossing with the SCCA in Oklahoma where I used to live. I was a rookie driver and of course when everyone beat me it was "Hey! I beat the Viper!"

They didn't beat the Viper, they beat the driver...but I didnt' have any moral high ground to try and explain or argue the point at the time.

US Naval War College Pretty Good Rule #2

Never wrestle with a pig, pig likes it and you both get dirty.

LtCDRAugs, retired.
2003,4 Utah State H Stock SCCA Champion
2004 Rocky Mountain H Stock SCCA Regional Champion
#14 2003 Mini Cooper

Exactly. Great post. Sure, they're not jealous of people with the means to buy one (either and H2 OR Rubi). They're just SO TIRED of the endelss attitude they get from H2 owners. What? I guess I'm guilty as charged. Every time I'm at a gas station filling up I, like 95% of all H2 owners, go running around shouting "I can afford and H2 and you can't, so nah, nah, nah, nah-hah". What a load of crap. He's suggesting that the 95% that don't take their rigs offroad are, by definition, a-holes with attitudes? Give me a break. At least the 95% of H2 owners that don't wheel have the sense to buy a car that has a luxury interior and ride. The 95% of Rubi owners who don't wheel just have a poser vehicle with zero non-wheeling benefits. So who is the bigger idiot?

Think about that statement and please tell me why YOU have a problem AND what that problem that is.

I am really interesting to see how you response to the above question.

There are many things people do in their lives that I have no interest in, however if they have no impact on me why in the world would I have a problem. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Alec, You will never get a real answer to that question (which I'm sure you know). There is no possible explanation other than one which points to ENVY. Not envy of the actual vehicle of course, but the means to buy one (or "throw away" money on).

P.S. I HATE fine wine because MD 20/20 does the same thing for less money.

LMAO

Is it wrong that I know what that is?

But to offset that, I know my cabs.

Is it wrong that I know what that is?

But to offset that, I know my cabs. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

See. There you go, sticking that fine wine crap in my face. I'm so damn sick of you connoisseurs and your "my wine is better than yours" attitude. I run into you people nearly every day. Always flaunting yours ridiculously overpriced wines in my face. But hey, I know that about 5% of you will actually slug down a bottle and tie one one. So a couple of you are ok by me. Let's drink.

Works for me, muddy. Thanks.

Paragon, I thought you saidWith the MD talk, I had to do a double take.

I feel better now Could barely sleep :0 just kidding. Ok, so read as well that the new JP Wrangler, or new model will resemble somewhat the H2, like a mini H2, last JPMagazine. Any info on that?

Gui

I apologize. There, is that better? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

HAHAHAHAH!



Is it wrong that I know what that is?

But to offset that, I know my cabs. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

See. There you go, sticking that fine wine crap in my face. I'm so damn sick of you connoisseurs and your "my wine is better than yours" attitude. I run into you people nearly every day. Always flaunting yours ridiculously overpriced wines in my face. But hey, I know that about 5% of you will actually slug down a bottle and tie one one. So a couple of you are ok by me. Let's drink. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>