Synthetic oil

[Recmar1]

My truck is about due for an oil change and someone mentioned I should try synthetic oil. Used SO in my previous car which was a BMW and that was the standard. I know that SO will last longer between changes, but does anyone know of any pros and/or cons.

[GLBLWARMR]

I am sure that you will get alot of different answers on this question. I will not give the scientific details like I am sure that others can and most likely will. Anyways, I have not used SO in any of my vehicles and I have a couple of vehicles with over 150,000 miles on them. I have been a Quaker State boy all my life and I still use it to this day. Regardless of what they say you can go in between oil changes I still change my oil every 3000 miles, plugs every 20,000 and keep up on all the other preventive maintenance. I do not see the need to spend the money on SO when in 3000 miles I am going to drain it anyways. I know what all the manuals say but I am superstitious and will continue to be. If it ain't broke don't fix it.

[HUMMERcustoms.com/TAZ]

I agree with GLBLWRMR if I spelled it right. I do use Royal Purple in all areas of H2 though because I'm running such high boost, HP and Torque. I do as He says and do not extend changing times. I follow the old school book.
I also have several trucks well my rule is put 250,000 miles before I get another work truck and have run Penzoil on the last 2 which one was a diesel. Niether of them would use enough oil in 3000 miles that you could really notice. I did use K&N air filter systems. The present 99 Silverado which is a everyday truck not work truck has 150,000 miles on it and oil changes extended to 5,000 miles. Penzoil used along with K&N, Hypertech, dual exhaust, flowmasters and all the peformance stuff i can run on it. Will be tuning it soon with HPTUNERS software since i got it in from my sponsor of H2 to use. The Silverado is for peformance fun and love to see the rice rockets face when i run off from them. I use Penzoil and change plugs sooner than book says. It just rubs Me wrong to run spark plugs
100,000 miles just like I cannot run K&N filters 50,000 miles before cleaning. I use new tech. with old rules and seems to work well.
I most likely should use Royal Purple on the 99 Silverado but, I used Pen on it from new and makes Me feel wierd to think about changing what the old girl has been used to. I use regular oil in everything I just SO in H2 because of all the real high stress that is put on it occasionally. Hummer sends it out of factory with GM SO in it in certain areas I just figured it would not hurt to go 100% SO in this rigs circumstances with Us pushing it with more and more boost and water/methanol inj. all that kind of stuff.

I also saw on Speed Channel it was HP TV show where they took a camaro and ran it on a dyno with regular oil then switched to SO oil and the rig gained 8 HP just by changing to Royal Purple, for what it is worth.

TAZ

[DRTYFN]

Mobil One synthetic and a K&N oil filter.

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/...nce_5W-30.aspx


http://www.knfilters.com/search/prod...x?Prod=HP-1007

[MONSTERMATT]

amsoil synthetic and k%n filter

[DRTYFN]

I've tried Royal Purple and Amsoil in the past(I really cheered for Amsoil, too), but I've gone back to the tried & true Mobil1 synthetic - mainly because a case of it is $23 at Costco.

[ssgharkness020147]

If you want to run sythetic go for it. As others have said change it at 3K. K&N filters are OK. Stay far the hell away from Fram. I've used them all, and I have cut them all apart when they are done to inspect them. I personally am most impressed by WIX, the quality of the guts in those things is the best in my opion. Being a diesel owner (with and IDI system) my oil turns black almost immediatly. With a WIX filter the change of color is a much more gradual process.

[HUMMERcustoms.com/TAZ]

DRTYFN You make a good choice with Mobile 1 also. I have not used it but the guys I know that do love the heck out of the stuff.

I have not tried the K&N oil filters. Would You give Me a little insight as to why they are a good choice? I use Pennzoil filters on all except H2. It gets the factory filter. If I should change please let me know. I used the Delco filters for a while on My 99 Silverado as the 5.3L was having trouble holding oil in top end and dry starting. Dealer said be sure and use factory as it had the spring in it to hold oil back. When Penn started adding spring and valve I went to them again.
Appreciate any help.

I'm glad you mentioned WIX. Before I retired from farming I had WIX on everything including power units and on all tractors. When i got away from farming and retired I wnet in different directions and just did not get near WIX as much. The more I think about it I remember being at a seminar where all the filters were cut in to that You wanted to bring. There were WIX and all kinds and the FRAM looked horrible. It was after that I went to WIX as the farmers that brought there used WIX looked better and even the clean ones when all cut open the WIX had allot more filtration material.
I may be going back to the WIX on the H2 now after You brinning it up.

TAZ

[GLBLWARMR]

Originally Posted by HUMMERcustoms.com/TAZ

I have not tried the K&N oil filters. Would You give Me a little insight as to why they are a good choice?

http://www.knfilters.com/oilfilter.htm

I use K&N sometimes. We have only one shop out here that sells them and it is on the other side of the island. They sometimes don't have them in stock and by the time that I realize it is oil change time I don't feel like ordering on the internet.

[Motohead]

Mobile! and K&N here...

DRTYFN is copying me...

[raptorman53]

I thought this was interesting.

http://neptune.spacebears.com/cars/s.../oil-life.html

[f5fstop]

Many of the additives used in modern dyno oils over the past few years are a lot better than used in the past; thus, the modern "Starburst" symbol dyno oil lasts longer and is more stable than oil used even five years ago. Unless the engine is of a race design, or has limited airflow to help cool it, dyno oil is all that is required. GM (and all other manufacturers) recommend the oils that they test the engines with during development.

Synthetic will not harm the engine, but in many cases, it is not necessary. Extreme hot conditions and extreme cold conditions will see some benefit, but then again, the GM oil life system, which monitors temps at startup and during engine run, will take this into consideration. Therefore, those who live in AZ will see their oil life percentage decrease faster than those living in MI during the summer. Same holds true to those up in Alaska. Those living in moderate temp areas, with four seasons, will also notice that during the summer their oil life percentage will not decrease as fast as during a cold winter.

You will also notice a difference with your driving habits. Change the oil and go cross country and your oil life percentage will drop slowly. Change your oil and make a hundred one-mile trips to Kroger a mile away, and your oil life percentage will decrease faster.

In addition, there are two primary type of synthetics; Group IV synthetics are made with PAOs, group III are highly refined dyno oil via a process called Hydro-cracking, that is labeled synthetic oil, and is legal to do so. (Mobil sued to have the name synthetic removed from Group III oils back in the late 90's and lost.) Hydro-cracking is less expensive than using PAOs. To be honest, the inroads in the development of Group III oil have made them almost as good as Group IV. There was supposed to be a Group III+ category, but not sure if it has been released.

Last tests I saw showed that only two oils were group IV:
Mobil 1
Amsoil ASL

All other major oils, advertised as synthetic were Group III:
Castrol
Shell
Pennzoil
Valvoline
Havoline
Quaker

It costs a lot less to manufacture Group III synthetics, but as we all know, they charge about the same as Group IV.

Now, to add confusion, there is a Group V synthetic oil based on Esters, and is used by Redline. The only true benefit of Group V is that it's high heat capabilities are superior to Group III and Group IV. A normal car/truck engine will not benefit by the use of Esters, but it certainly won't hurt. Air cooled and Jet engines benefit greatly with a Group V oil.

Another type of oil that is the "blend." When you mix a synthetic with a dyno oil, the oil takes on the characteristics of the lowest group type used. Therefore, a blend oil is basically worthless. If you are considering a blend, you might as well save your money and go with a dyno or pay more and go with a synthetic.

Most important factor, is always use the recommended spec, or a spec that exceeds the spec for your engine. This is important on systems using oil life monitoring systems. The system algorithms are developed knowing the rate of decline of the oil approved with that spec. Using an oil without that spec would make the system inaccurate. So, the oil life indicator might indicate 50%, but the oil is really degraded to around 30%. Using an oil with a greater spec (synthetic), would also make the oil life monitoring system inaccurate, but won't harm the engine. With an oil that exceeds the spec, the oil life system may show a percentage of 50%, but the oil life is actually at around 70%.

If you are really curious, run dyno oil for 6K miles and send it to a testing lab like Blackstones (Indiana), and for twenty bucks they will test it and send you a full report. Look at the TBN number, the higher the number, the better the oil has remained. Then do a synthetic oil change, run 6K and do the same thing. Unless you live in an area with severe weather, you will notice little differences between the TBN numbers.

One of the most important things about oil changes but are greatly overlooked are the filters. Changing your oil and installing a cheap filter is not a good idea. The testing I saw years ago (by an independent firm), had three filters at the top of the list:
AC Delco Ultraguard (NO LONGER IN PRODUCTION) filtered down to 8 microns
Mobil 1, filtered down to approx. 10 microns
K&N, filtered down to approx. 12 microns
All filters not only filtered down to the lowest number of microns, but also allowed oil to flow at a required rate. All three of these filters used synthetic filtering media.
The latest test results I reviewed, showed the following:
AC Delco Duraguard (Champion)
Mobil 1 (Champion)
K&N (Champion, I believe)
Fram Tough Guard not the stock Fram (Allied Signal)
Motorcraft (Purolator)
WIX (Purolator)

Filters to avoid:
Fram Extra Guard
Fram Double Guard
Pennzoil (By Allied Signal)
Quaker State (Allied Signal)

AMSOIL not tested (Baldwin)

Most filters are manufactured by Champion, Baldwin, Allied Signal (Fram) or Purolator; however, they are all manufactured to different specs issued by the purchasing company. (Allied Signal actually makes Fram filters for use by Fram and other suppliers who purchase the filters from Fram.) The important thing to note in a filer is the filtering media, how much surface is used to filter the oil, a strong metal case to withstand the high oil pressures, and a bypass valve as well as an anti-drainback valve (if required).
The right paper media does a good job filtering while allowing for sustained oil flow, synthetic media allows for smaller passages to filter smaller particles while still allowing required oil flow.
The bypass valve allows the oil to bypass the media if it should become plugged or during times of extreme cold startups. Better to have some dirty oil circulating in the engine, than no oil. The anti-drainback valve is not required on all vehicles. For example, with the oil filter mounted vertically, the filter will remain filled at all times. However, when the filter is mounted horizontally or on another angle, some oil will drain back into the engine when oil pressure is zero, so it takes a few seconds to fill it when startup. The anti-drainback valve prevents oil from draining back into the engine. Most filters in this day and age, have both the bypass and anti-drainback valves.

Now that I have said this (again), I will admit to running Mobil 1 with Mobil Oil filters; however, I do not do it for the synthetic oil, I do it because I have gallons of the stuff. A few years ago, before leaving TN, PEP boys had a 1/2 off sale on Mobil 1, and they had no limits. Therefore, I filled my Jeep with cases of oil, and last year, I filled it again when I moved to MI (Movers would not move flammable liquids).
I only use Mobil filters since Ultraguard was discontinued. I would have no problem using K&N or WIX, but the auto zone near where I work does not carry &N or WIX, so I go with Mobil 1.

Enough said. Like GLBLWARMR stated, you wlll get get alot of different answers on this question.

[Big Z]

Originally Posted by Recmar1

My truck is about due for an oil change and someone mentioned I should try synthetic oil. Used SO in my previous car which was a BMW and that was the standard. I know that SO will last longer between changes, but does anyone know of any pros and/or cons.

http://www.elcovaforums.com/forums/s...searchid=58757

Synthetic EVERYTHING! ...Pro's! it's Mo Better than Dino!....Con's...it costs a little more! I just switched to Synthetic in my boat--Second oil change--made a VERY Noticable difference!---The big one!--It's running cooler, and Mo Better!

Oil changes @ 5-6000 miles----More if you do oil analysis!---But this is true with ANY OIL!

The Pros outweigh the cons!

[Recmar1]

F5Fstop - brilliant. Thanks, much for the detailed info.